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Thread: Brexit thread 2 Electric Boogaloo

  1. #281
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    Quote Originally Posted by redebreck View Post
    Is Cameron still involved in the Tory party?
    He started this shit storm.
    Post premiership from wikipedia:

    In October 2016, Cameron became chairman of the National Citizen Service Patrons.[306]
    In January 2017, he was appointed president of Alzheimer's Research UK to address misconceptions surrounding dementia and campaign for medical research funding to tackle the condition.[307]

    All appointments post-premiership have to be approved by the UK government advisory committee. In addition to the two posts above they also approved the following positions:[308]

    Consultant for Illumina Inc.
    Vice-Chair, UK China Fund
    Director, ONE
    Consultant for First Data Corp.
    Member of Council of Foreign Relations
    Chairman, LSE-Oxford Commission on Growth in Fragile States
    Registered member of Washington Speakers Bureau
    Chairman of advisory board, Afiniti[309]
    --------------
    The CFR !!

  2. #282
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    Quote Originally Posted by Balinkay View Post
    Isn't he elected by the members of his party? I agree it's an odd way to go about it, but I don't think you could say he lacks the democratic mandate of the people.

    This is looking fun though - do you recon you guys are getting a "snap" election?

    He is and its largely in line with the Tory voters wishes more widely, theyd prefer mogg but he wasnt in the running.

    It's hard to know what is going on right now Bali. It's gone to shit since they got the extension to override article 50.
    Boris says deal and if not no deal, think most of the common folk on that side are no deal leaning.
    Corbyn/Swinson say never no deal, with a deal/remain split and it's hard to gauge the public leaning, I'd suggest public leaning remain.

    Read that tonight's vote and tomorrow's expected results do not have to be taken on board as there is a precedent for doing so, iirc by Blair.

    The mad thing is, it looks like the Tories want a general election and corbyn/swinson dont as they are essentially having a blair/Corbyn battle via libs/labour. But Blair has interjected himself again into the issues and this might swing Corbyn into an election call as Blair has literally suggested an election is a bad idea with Corbyn in situ. Blair doesn't seem to realise how toxic he actually is in British politics and how hard Corbyn opposes him.

    While the reality would seem to be that if there is a general election, or when there is one, Brexit will be the key issue. The lib/lab spat is also why they wont table a motion of no confidence to oust BJ, it seems even more so the reason than the Tories 'defectors' not wanting Corbyn as PM.

    The remain fear is that a general election would produce an actual pro Brexit parliament if I understand their electoral system properly.
    https://fullfact.org/europe/did-majority-conservative-and-labour-constituencies-vote-leave-eu-referendum/

    Of course there is the Brexit party to contend with and voting pact strategies.

    We live in interesting times as a result of bad politics (and increasingly people too perhaps) with 7 conflict zones this century via the caring hand of destabilising geopolitical interventionism and everyone's losing their shit about the disruption of trade and what the material future holds. ����

    The amount of misinformation going around presently is rather dangerous imo.
    Last edited by CCTV; 4th September 2019 at 02:59 AM.

  3. #283
    Quote Originally Posted by Balinkay View Post
    Isn't he elected by the members of his party? I agree it's an odd way to go about it, but I don't think you could say he lacks the democratic mandate of the people.

    This is looking fun though - do you recon you guys are getting a "snap" election?
    Oh yes of course he's elected by members of his own party but not by the British people. When labour installed Gordon Brown as prime minister without the people's vote our Boris said it was undemocratic and called for an election.

    It looks like we might get an election next month...
    Last edited by stevie harkness; 4th September 2019 at 06:55 AM.

  4. #284
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    @CC - cheers for the info mate!

    @sh - Whaat, Boris "I have two articles prepared for the morning after Brexit, one which says we won our freedom and one which says we've just lost it" (this might be bullshite tbf) is an unprincipled twofaced cunt?! Why I'd never! What a shock this is! I am speechless! Tbf to him you could probably put any politician's name there and it'd still work.

    On a more serious note, I wouldn't say he's unelected - he's the leader of the biggest party, which was elected. I do agree it's odd that you could potentially vote for a party with a certain person in charge and then get someone completely different in a year. But I guess this is just one of the oddities of your (to an outsider) absurdly complicated and ancient form of democracy.
    Etiam si omnes, ego non

  5. #285
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    Larry the cat leaves Boris’ half-dead career outside Downing Street back door

    Boris Johnson’s political career has been found mauled and dying outside Number ten.

    The Prime Minister woke up this morning on the sofa where Carrie Symonds makes him sleep. As his dreams faded into nothingness he remembered yesterday’s events and cursed.

    He’d lost his majority, lost control of the House, lost the initiative.

    He knew he should probably get up but his body was under attack from all four elements: his mouth sand, his eyes water, his bladder fire. As for the wind…

    Groaning, he lifted his head and squinted against the sunlight streaming through the curtains. He made the daily promise to himself never to drink again. His instinct, as ever these days, was to stay exactly where he was and not worry about getting up and finding a way to occupy his time.

    Boris closed his eyes again, the self-pity of the previous evening replaced with shame and self-loathing. It was, he supposed, a daily routine of sorts.

    Come on old chap, he told himself – you still have a country to run.

    He shuffled past the master bedroom where Carrie was snoring peacefully and into the kitchen. As he was pouring out his Coco Pops he heard a scratching at the back door.

    It was Larry the cat – and he’d left Boris a little present.

    The Prime Minister gazed down at the remains of his political career. Broken and twitching, with a little bit of intestine hanging out, it was somehow still alive.

    He reminded himself that he was Boris Johnson. The country would go to the polls and it would vote for him.

    After all, people voted for Brexit – they were fucking idiots.

    Boris closed the back door and went to get dressed.

    Larry the cat smirked. He knew this game well – Johnson’s career was only still alive so it could be toyed with some more.

    Before finally being finished off for good.

    https://newsthump.com/2019/09/04/larry-the-cat-leaves-boris-half-dead-career-outside-downing-street-back-door/

  6. #286
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    Isn't he just going to win the snap election and get his majority back? If it happens relatively quickly, it might favour him.
    Etiam si omnes, ego non

  7. #287
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    Quote Originally Posted by Balinkay View Post
    @CC - cheers for the info mate!

    @sh - Whaat, Boris "I have two articles prepared for the morning after Brexit, one which says we won our freedom and one which says we've just lost it" (this might be bullshite tbf) is an unprincipled twofaced cunt?! Why I'd never! What a shock this is! I am speechless! Tbf to him you could probably put any politician's name there and it'd still work.

    On a more serious note, I wouldn't say he's unelected - he's the leader of the biggest party, which was elected. I do agree it's odd that you could potentially vote for a party with a certain person in charge and then get someone completely different in a year. But I guess this is just one of the oddities of your (to an outsider) absurdly complicated and ancient form of democracy.
    The mad part Bali is that since the vote they have tried to make out that voting for Brexit, wasnt voting for Brexit ie leaving the customs union and single market.. yet the leaflet delivered to every home in the UK was clear about this...

    It seems the remainers having said that a no deal Brexit is not what people voted for, despite mps overwhelmingly triggering article 50, they are making every effort to ensure that no deal vs remain will not be sent to the people.

    Sturgeon still wants to take Scotland out of the UK and essentially this would make the UK more pro Brexit since Scotland was 62 to 38 in favour of remain.

    You can find Corbyn laughing about how in Ireland (where he campaigned against the eu) we were forced to vote again until we got it right. Now hes on board with this idea in the UK.


  8. #288
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    Quote Originally Posted by Balinkay View Post
    Isn't he just going to win the snap election and get his majority back? If it happens relatively quickly, it might favour him.
    It's hard to know these days as there is a lot of volatility around, while polls arent exactly an impartial and honest approach anymore.

  9. #289
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    Well tbf CC, before Brexit happened it seemed to an outsider like me that the idea was to have an extremely favourable deal with the EU post Brexit. At least that's what I got from Gove and Bojo's rhetoric at the time. Could be making stuff up mind you, my memory's not what it used to be.

    I don't think it was a good idea to put it to a referendum and I don't think the referendum was implemented well - the issue is not really binary and not really one you on which you can trust any of the lies of the Brexitbros or the Eurocrats.
    Etiam si omnes, ego non

  10. #290
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    Quote Originally Posted by Balinkay View Post
    Well tbf CC, before Brexit happened it seemed to an outsider like me that the idea was to have an extremely favourable deal with the EU post Brexit. At least that's what I got from Gove and Bojo's rhetoric at the time. Could be making stuff up mind you, my memory's not what it used to be.

    I don't think it was a good idea to put it to a referendum and I don't think the referendum was implemented well - the issue is not really binary and not really one you on which you can trust any of the lies of the Brexitbros or the Eurocrats.
    Yes, not being in the eu and having a good trade deal was preferable. But it did entail leaving the eu cleanly. Fair to say some elements have thwarted such a deal from being struck including a desire from the EU to stop Brexit. You can find YouTube clips of EU officials talking about bribing MPs.
    Of course for some the eu would never screw over the British like trump would most certainly do according to these same people.

    The issue is quite simple are you remaining or leaving the eu as outlined in the referendum leaflet posted to every home in the UK.

    You've said this before about referendums and held a remainer idea initially of, having decided via a vote to leave that there should be a second referendum of remaining in the eu or taking a bad deal without leaving the eu as the two options.
    I argued that having voted to leave, that leaving the eu should be a permissible option for the proposed second referendum.
    May's deal v Leave without a deal on wto terms, which you did concede iirc was a fairer set of options as it involved leaving properly or a widely regarded bad deal and not leaving properly. People can say no deal is a bad deal also if they like but it does satisfy the criteria of leaving the eu.
    However the general idea of parliament is to refuse a no deal option from the ballot.
    I disagreed with you that a second referendum would be helpful, but maintain having no option to leave the eu in such a referendum would be quite clownish.

    Alas referendums as critiqued by you and more generally has a validity, yet they are not really a major issue overall. The swiss have a fair few of them and so do other countries.
    It would seem that a referendum is only a contentious issue that must be re-run when the democratic vote is against the wishes of the centralised supra-nationalist structure and the supra-humans running its wishes.

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