Coronavirus and the impact on football

[Taksin]

I don't mind the masks but they really should've be compulsory from the start.
But what I can have are the whoppers who wear them while driving. Dicks !!

Or maybe we should be free to wear what we want?

They don’t seem make any positive difference anyway - and the science has already concluded that they don’t so this looks like a propaganda exercise to me. This supposed outbreak comes well after they were being widely used.

[redebreck]

Or maybe we should be free to wear what we want?

They don’t seem make any positive difference anyway - and the science has already concluded that they don’t so this looks like a propaganda exercise to me. This supposed outbreak comes well after they were being widely used.

The masks are supposed to stop people who have Covid-19 symptoms (or are asymptomatic), and are wearing the mask,
passing the virus to other people.
Just because you're wearing a mask doesn't stop you catching it.
Two people together wearing masks should, in theory, be safe from catching it from each other.

Somebody who has Covid-19 and isn't wearing a mask, can pass it on to anyone - the mask is supposed to be a barrier to stop the virus entering the air/atmosphere around the "carrier".

If you go out on the street (and this has applied for months) you'll find anything from zero percent to forty/fifty/sixty
percent of people wearing masks. This means anyone not wearing a mask may potentially pass the virus on to anyone else.

(that's my understanding of how it should work)

[Kev0909]

Pretty sure national curfew will be announced soon the pubs, 10pm shuts everywhere

Honestly, how will that change anything?

Forgot the virus only comes out at night.

"circuit break" won't do fuck all, everyone will be day drinkers instead

[Taksin]

The masks are supposed to stop people who have Covid-19 symptoms (or are asymptomatic), and are wearing the mask,
passing the virus to other people.
Just because you're wearing a mask doesn't stop you catching it.
Two people together wearing masks should, in theory, be safe from catching it from each other.

Somebody who has Covid-19 and isn't wearing a mask, can pass it on to anyone - the mask is supposed to be a barrier to stop the virus entering the air/atmosphere around the "carrier".

If you go out on the street (and this has applied for months) you'll find anything from zero percent to forty/fifty/sixty
percent of people wearing masks. This means anyone not wearing a mask may potentially pass the virus on to anyone else.

(that's my understanding of how it should work)

Hi redebrek

I realise that’s the theory I just don’t think that’s how it works in reality. We’ve had various experts pointing out that masks don’t work since the beginning - remember the only thing we know that works is washing your hands - and that’s why they weren’t enforced from the beginning. As far as I’m aware all the studies show the same thing.

Then someone at the WHO changed their mind and everyone had to follow suit. Or they didn’t have to follow suit, they could have followed the science, but the way the pressurisation happens, they felt they had no option.

Now, where the pressurisation is coming from is a very interesting question. I have tried to work this out and in the end I had to admit that I was carrying a conspiracy theory in my head and that I believed in it. But we can’t say that as we get called conspiracy loons just for objecting at the moment. Maybe things will change in time. I asked people today how many of their friends and family believe in all this lockdown policy and my sample were fairly confident most people thought it was mostly bollocks, including one GP. And they all also knew someone who was following the advice obsessively and to the letter. These are strange times.

This ‘second spike’ at the moment comes many weeks after the masks were introduced. If you look at a chart, there is no relation between the two things. Even if the masks were known to be effective, I would still argue that a person should be free to choose their own risks. This idea that we are all letting the side down is, in my opinion, a totalitarian impulse that we should be very careful about forcing on each other.

[scientificred]

Hi redebrek

I realise that’s the theory I just don’t think that’s how it works in reality. We’ve had various experts pointing out that masks don’t work since the beginning - remember the only thing we know that works is washing your hands - and that’s why they weren’t enforced from the beginning. As far as I’m aware all the studies show the same thing.

Then someone at the WHO changed their mind and everyone had to follow suit. Or they didn’t have to follow suit, they could have followed the science, but the way the pressurisation happens, they felt they had no option.

Now, where the pressurisation is coming from is a very interesting question. I have tried to work this out and in the end I had to admit that I was carrying a conspiracy theory in my head and that I believed in it. But we can’t say that as we get called conspiracy loons just for objecting at the moment. Maybe things will change in time. I asked people today how many of their friends and family believe in all this lockdown policy and my sample were fairly confident most people thought it was mostly bollocks, including one GP. And they all also knew someone who was following the advice obsessively and to the letter. These are strange times.

This ‘second spike’ at the moment comes many weeks after the masks were introduced. If you look at a chart, there is no relation between the two things. Even if the masks were known to be effective, I would still argue that a person should be free to choose their own risks. This idea that we are all letting the side down is, in my opinion, a totalitarian impulse that we should be very careful about forcing on each other.

And surely there have been various experts pointing out how masks/face coverings work.
They reduce the plume of your expiration.
Also not only washing your hands regularly but keeping distance is known to work.
Maybe why the 2nd spike has come many weeks after masks were 'introduced' is because many people refuse to wear them or do not wear them properly (perhaps together also with not washing hands regularly or keeping safe distance where appropriate).

[redebreck]

The area where I live, Blaenau Gwent, has, for months now, had a mixture of mainly people not wearing masks anywhere, and a much smaller number of people who wear masks mainly in shops or similar. It's only recently that wearing masks has become more commonplace. Welsh Government directive I believe.
If you have a scenario where some people wear masks and others don't, it's difficult to know what will happen.
In a scenario where nobody wears masks and people don't wash their hands, the virus will spread.
In a scenario where everyone wears a mask and washes hands, the virus should not spread.

[scientificred]

The area where I live, Blaenau Gwent, has, for months now, had a mixture of mainly people not wearing masks anywhere, and a much smaller number of people who wear masks mainly in shops or similar. It's only recently that wearing masks has become more commonplace. Welsh Government directive I believe.
If you have a scenario where some people wear masks and others don't, it's difficult to know what will happen.
In a scenario where nobody wears masks and people don't wash their hands, the virus will spread.
In a scenario where everyone wears a mask and washes hands, the virus should not spread.

Plus keeping distance Rede where appropriate.
For added info and perhaps some comfort!.....
Listening to Dr Chris Smith the other day saying virus is not a living thing as we know it. It needs a host (like us) to replicate and so survive. It is therefore not in the interest of the virus to actually kill us so hopefully it mutates to a less virulent form.

[Taksin]

And surely there have been various experts pointing out how masks/face coverings work.

Yes there’s a whole host of experts joining in with this push for compliance. What I’m saying is they are not asking us to act on the science but instead on something else.

I know a lot of people / experts want to believe they make a big difference but that doesn’t seem to be true according to the science. All I can say that this state of affairs doesn’t surprise me - I realise it doesn’t seem feasible to many people but it seems typical to me these days.

To give you an example. We’ve been told for fifty years or so that we need to eat a low fat diet and a high carb diet for our health and to lose weight. Well, many scientists now believe that was a terrible mistake that has caused an epidemic of obesity and ill health. Are you able to convince your family members that a low fat diet is bad for them? No, the belief is hard to shift. In fact only last year I heard a GP (an expert) on the radio calling for butter to be banned. The experts managed to get a whole generation eating margarine, which is basically a poison, and I have family members who still won’t give it up. People believe what they want to believe.

I don’t mind if you think a face mask will save you and your family but I do object to you imposing your views on me. The fact that this massive and now seemingly endless fuss is being coordinated globally for a disease that, in the past, would have passed with very little attention has become a surreal experience for people like me. I think people’s beliefs about why the virus is spreading are mostly wrong and their faith in our attempts to control it is misplaced.

[scientificred]

There is no actual thing as 'the science' Taksin.
And in what way am I imposing my views on you?
I am merely posting views (and not necessarily my own) on a forum.

[Taksin]

There is no actual thing as 'the science' Taksin.
And in what way am I imposing my views on you?
I am merely posting views (and not necessarily my own) on a forum.

I’ve just watched people on the news saying they support £1000 fines for various infringements of the guidelines. That’s a desire of people to impose their views on me. I wasn’t singling you out but in order to feel justified as they do they have to hold your beliefs on how masks and lockdown work. I think those opinions are wrong, which is why having them imposed on me is very irritating.

In this instance, by the science I mean the studies on the effectiveness of masks. Those studies show no effectiveness. So there is science and there is belief. They are different ways of forming an opinion and a policy.