Coronavirus and the impact on football

[scientificred]

I doubt whether Thiago is even infectious. The PCR tests have proven to be too sensitive and are causing unwarranted alarm.

For anyone interested, here’s a decent NY Times article explaining why, following the research from I think Oxford university that showed false positives due to the calibration of the test. The PCR test was shown to amplify the presence of pathogen to the extent that dormant fragments of the pathogen appear to be infectious.

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.nytimes.com/2020/08/29/health/coronavirus-testing.amp.html

Dear Taksin,
I think you should stop being our forum resident expert on this illness.
As an aside what do you think constitutes an expert?
For myself I regard myself as an excellent technician who has worked with many so-called or self-titled experts but very few if any deserves that title. Maybe my karate teacher

[Kev0909]

It’s not just us, there are already a ridiculous number of injuries and as in our instance, cases of Covid. It’s not going to get better any time soon, there is absolutely no rest in between games, ridiculous and pointless International breaks with players flying to all parts, to so many different nations all with the pandemic at different stages and widely varying levels of social distancing and Covid compliance.
There are currently 16 Salford Rugby League players self isolating, that’s what we very likely have to look forward to.
It’s a mess.

I'm not sure where thiago picked it up from but the thing is as professionals and the money involved, they really should be as safe as possible and like a lot of normal people are doing right now be careful of contact of people around you.

It baffles me, surely they hate the public? You'd think professional footballers would be pretty safe as they live in their own bubble and world in a way, if shouldn't be happening and it shouldn't of happened at our club amateur stuff

[stevie harkness]

We've been in our bubble for months, our first covid case was August pre season training camp in Austria. Tsimikas tested positive on international duty but none of the other Greek players did. So where did he get it? Thiago. Mane. If you assume the tests are accurate then it must have come from somewhere. And if it's so infectious there'll be many more.

[teesred]

Liverpool currently has a very high infection rate so could have come from that aspect. Its bound to creep in from somewhere, players are still seeing their families etc and prior to restrictions imposed in Liverpool maybe their family members will have been in contact with others.

[Taksin]

Dear Taksin,
I think you should stop being our forum resident expert on this illness.
As an aside what do you think constitutes an expert?
For myself I regard myself as an excellent technician who has worked with many so-called or self-titled experts but very few if any deserves that title. Maybe my karate teacher

That's a strange thing to say, SR. Since when does expressing doubts make you an expert? I've linked to a NY times article explaining the state of play with these tests. There are similar British articles. It's in the public domain. I have linked to many sources to back up what I've said on this thread.

I note that one article claimed Mané is experiencing 'mild symptoms', which would prove me wrong if true. Having said that, my next doubt would be whether he has anything more than loss of sense of smell, something that would not stop someone from playing football under any other circumstances.

Oh, and a thousand people died of the flu last week, far more than did from Covid. I heard that on the radio but I'm not claiming to be an expert.

best wishes

[Taksin]

As an aside what do you think constitutes an expert?

That's a very interesting question. Perhaps you should have a go at answering it yourself as it is something that is bothering you.

I made some comments about this earlier in the thread. I don't believe in following experts. I respect people who have knowledge and experience. However, science is much more limited that we like to believe - and this is especially so with complex systems.

Medicine is not a pure science it is an applied science. So are sociology, algorithmic modelling, economics and public policy, all of which are at play in the current situation. There is no scientific proof that these lockdowns have made a blind bit of difference - it is currently wishful thinking.

I used the example earlier of the recommendation to eat a low fat and high carb diet that has persisted to this day for forty odd years. I believe it's wrong and I am more of an expert on the matter than most GPs I've met, for example. This false idea has led to many millions of people essentially poisoning themselves with margarine for decades, not to mention an epidemic of metabolic disorders caused by the effects on insulin.

So I approach most expertise with scepticism, especially when they are playing round with my own life. Don't you?

[Balinkay]

You're a doctor of some sort, right, Taksin?

[Taksin]

You're a doctor of some sort, right, Taksin?

Yes but I am not inclined to reveal those details on here, mate, for one reason or another. Anyway, I don’t personally believe being a doctor trumps being a taxi driver. We all have to weigh up the facts and decide what we believe. No one has a handle on absolute truth.

I know lots of doctors and there is a surprising amount of disagreement. One’s relationship to risk and one’s relationship to the government seem to be more important than one’s knowledge of coronaviruses.

At the beginning of the pandemic Professor Wittkowski made the point that three different kinds of experts would look at this differently. A physician in a hospital, a virologist and an epidemiologist. This response is driven by epidemiologists and he, as a fellow epidemiologist, thinks they have got it all wrong. I agree with him.

[Taksin]

As far as contact tracing goes, does anyone know why the whole squad hasn’t been asked to self isolate? Isn’t that the theory. When I write my name and number down in the book at the restaurant, I’m expecting a call to say someone was positive that evening and therefore everyone has to isolate. Doesn’t seem consistent to say footballers aren’t in close quarters.

[stevie harkness]

Yes, I was just thinking the same thing. And the opposition players they've come into contact with. The mysteries of medical science...