Summer transfer thread

[Steveo]

He's got Bali by the curly wurlys

Post of the night...

[Balinkay]

You're right, Noods, that's not exactly what you said. However, the threshold you've set seems unreasonably high to put it mildly, thus basically changing nothing in the sentiment of my previous post.

I do agree we're not likely to know the truth, but you don't even seem to be making a conscious effort to get close to it.

And you keep trying to rile me up by bringing up the fact I'm likely twice as young as you are, which you know annoys me. That's not really like you - you're generally act reasonably decently on here.


What you call evidence boils down to "this is the way I see it, if you don't, you're a shill or <insert other explanation>". I'd be more likely to see it your way were you to provide some actual (slightly more) objective data. But you won't. Which is why we keep going in the circle of "FSG are evil -> prove it -> you're too young and lack common sense -> show me the common sense -> FSG are evil" or something of the sort.


I mean I was more willing to accept this sort of thing when talking to Steveo about Maradona since that really was something that you're not likely to get any sort of data on and we even today probably don't have the tech to record enough data to completely replace watching a single player. For teams we probably do, but I'd imagine it's more difficult for an individual.

[Balinkay]

He's got Bali by the curly wurlys

Bold of you to assume I'm capable of growing pubic hair.

[Insidious]

But no clubs are spending money!!

At least we've signed cadbury's

Phil Collins "In the Air tonight" drum solo ad with "Boring" James Milner or Klopp being revealed as being inside the Gorilla suit is an advertiser's dream to be fair.

[RedNoodle]

You're right, Noods, that's not exactly what you said. However, the threshold you've set seems unreasonably high to put it mildly, thus basically changing nothing in the sentiment of my previous post.

I do agree we're not likely to know the truth, but you don't even seem to be making a conscious effort to get close to it.

And you keep trying to rile me up by bringing up the fact I'm likely twice as young as you are, which you know annoys me. That's not really like you - you're generally act reasonably decently on here.


What you call evidence boils down to "this is the way I see it, if you don't, you're a shill or <insert other explanation>". I'd be more likely to see it your way were you to provide some actual (slightly more) objective data. But you won't.

Eh? I have made more than a concerted effort to arrive at the truth by detailing things such as why our finances are (despite almost certainly being downplayed) their best ever, and examples such as FSG building a new stand AND a new training ground BEFORE we were in the position (both on and off the field) that we are currently are. Why would FSG have done that back when our finances were not a patch on what they are now if we were having to look after the pennies? The answer is they wouldn't. How the Fudge can you not see/understand this?

I'm not trying to rile you up, but your reluctance to see things as they almost certainly are given all the evidence means that the only other option is to label you in such a way that I would do if I was dealing with someone I wasn't trying to be amicable with, or what I would shout at the tv or radio if I heard someone else saying similar sorts of things. Now I could do that, but I'd prefer to just put your stance down to 'not knowing any better'.

Another couple of examples for you. Have you never heard or read about someone wealthy and/or famous who has declared bankruptcy, only for them to still live or suddenly move into a seven figure home, all whilst driving around in a very expensive car? Do you believe everything a politician says? If not, why not? Surely until it can be categorically proved otherwise, everything they have ever said is 100% correct?

[Gaz_86]

Don’t get why some fans on twitter etc are so horny for transfers . You can’t improve this first XI massively unless we spend £100m + which in this climate is bad business. I wish The window closed this week

[Balinkay]

Eh? I have made more than a concerted effort to arrive at the truth by detailing things such as why our finances are (despite almost certainly being downplayed) their best ever, and examples such as FSG building a new stand AND a new training ground BEFORE we were in the position (both on and off the field) that we are currently are.

Detailing? I might have missed it, but I haven't seen a single post from you regarding our finances that is anywhere near what I'd consider detailed. Take this one for example - the new stand was paid for by an interest free loan. Doesn't really tell us a large amount about how much money the club has to spend. The 50m for Kirkby are being paid for the club, though I'm not sure into which fiscal year that expenditure lands - the redevelopment was confirmed in the summer of 2018 and was meant to be completed by this summer (obviously COVID had other plans). It is guesswork, but it might be possible for that 50m to be in any of the three fiscal years. A detailed post would take both of those questions into account.

Why would FSG have done that back when our finances were not a patch on what they are now if we were having to look after the pennies? The answer is they wouldn't. How the Fudge can you not see/understand this?

See this is what I'm talking about - done what? The stadium was redeveloped with an interest free loan and the cost of the new training ground is quite possibly (and likely) paid in fiscal years where we've been in this position. Then you say "our finances were not a patch on what they are now" - what does this mean? Does it mean we've got a bigger turnover? That's true for sure. Does it mean we're making a greater pre tax profit? I think that's true? Does it mean we're making a good operating profit? I mean we're basically breaking even. You seem to be using it to imply that the club is making a great operating profit, but there's really no way to tell what you're trying to say. And since you conveniently think our fiscal numbers are the work of the devil you can't be proven wrong, no matter what you're trying to say. Do you not see the issue here?

This is why I keep telling you that your "common sense" is flawed at best and totally wrong at worst. Its very premisses at time are shaky, not to mention the conclusions.

I'm not trying to rile you up, but your reluctance to see things as they almost certainly are given all the evidence means that the only other option is to label you in such a way that I would do if I was dealing with someone I wasn't trying to be amicable with, or what I would shout at the tv or radio if I heard someone else saying similar sorts of things. Now I could do that, but I'd prefer to just put your stance down to 'not knowing any better'.

What evidence? You say something that's a bit wishy-washy like "they used to spend money back in the day, but don't know", then you ask why and since you can't think of an answer you assume it's because they're evil incarnate . You don't look for a different possible explanation. That's not evidence and does not constitute looking for the facts in my book. It's the opposite. It's a bit like asking "why is there thunder?" and an elder answering "well it's obviously because the gods are having a chariot race up there!".

Another couple of examples for you. Have you never heard or read about someone wealthy and/or famous who has declared bankruptcy, only for them to still live or suddenly move into a seven figure home, all whilst driving around in a very expensive car? Do you believe everything a politician says? If not, why not? Surely until it can be categorically proved otherwise, everything they have ever said is 100% correct?

What are you trying to demonstrate here, Noods? That people lie? That corporations lie? Of course one shouldn't just be taking them at their word, but cooking the books in this grand manner would constitute defrauding other shareholders I'd guess. The UK seems to be a fairly well functioning country and should have laws against doing such things. I suspect the real reason you won't accept any numbers as valid is because that basically makes your claim unfalsifiable unless I change your common sense. I'm decent with words, but I'm not sure I'm that good.

Do you really not see the issue? You claim our finances are much better than before? What do you base that on? What does it mean?

Let me illustrate my point with a somewhat absurd example: I think it's common sense that our finances are way worse than before since we now have a much bigger wage bill, possibly as high as fifth in the world. And we're clearly not making as much money as United, Real, Barca, Bayern or Juve - I mean the've been a lot more successful than us recently, so that's just common sense. City, Chelsea and PSG have infinite money too. If we're outspending 4-5 of those teams, we're clearly overspending hugely. Probably all of our money is spent on wages! We might be making a bit more cash than we were, but Liverpool was always beloved by millions, so we were always selling shirts, so our income shouldn't have soared so much. But our wages have skyrocketed, I mean we've got VVD, Mane, Salah, Firmino, Alisson who are all on 200kpw at least - that's just how much they're worth in today's market, don't believe the figures FSG feed you. FSG have massively overspent on players so now we have to sell to survive. FSG out, they've derailed the club!

This is a bit extreme, but that's essentially what I'm getting from you.


We're speaking a fundamentally different language and start with very different axioms. Were we talking face to face I'm fairly certain we'd reach a consensus, given several month of intense debate. Can't see that happening with this medium.

[toneata]

Don’t get why some fans on twitter etc are so horny for transfers . You can’t improve this first XI massively unless we spend £100m + which in this climate is bad business. I wish The window closed this week

First 11?, maybe not but it's rare a first 11 wins you a title, you'd have to be incredibly lucky with injuries or sacrifice some cup competitions....or even BOTH..........sound familiar?

My fear is this is the season we see some burn out, and it would be completely understandable off the back of 2 incredible years. A couple of astute quality signings, not mega signings could make all the difference in what will be another hugely draining season when every single team wants to take a swing at the champions.

We're not 20 points better than City and 30 better than the rest, this season will be a dog fight from the off.

It feels like we're standing still and hoping for the best, when we were talking about dominating for years just seven short weeks ago.

[Insidious]

Aston Villa are closing in on a club-record deal for Brentford striker Ollie Watkins after agreeing a fee of £28m which could rise to £33m with add-ons.

Brentford at it again.

Signed Watkins and Benrama for a combined fee of around £5m or so and they'll end up making about £50m - that's excellent business at their level.

[Taksin]

That Mbappe has got a bounty on his head

Soft lad