Fulham v Liverpool (Match Thread)

[HLOGI]

its a tad unfair when Chelsea and Man-city have owners who can simply waft away the loss of income regarding fans in the ground (tens of millions).. we cant sign anyone major because of it.. yes we did get Jota. but we will end recuperating most of the fee on Brewster and Orgi who may go in January. I feel Mane is likely to leave the summer. hes getting a bit stale in my opinion. But he needs to up his game like the other forwards.

Bit harsh on Mane. Beginning of the season he won us many points. He has dropped a few games. But today he was one of our better players.

[HLOGI]

I mean,.......surely those can't be the only two options (that either they're "perfect", which no one claimed nor pretended they are, or that they are complete shite and should fuck off).

Also, acting like or claiming that they're doing things on the cheap or don't want to spend is a little rich considering the fact that we have the world's most expensive (and best) defender in our squad, the world's second most expensive (and BEST) goalkeeper in our squad and the world's 4th highest paid player overall (in Mo, and only paid less than Messi, Ronaldo and Mbappe).
Does that sound to you like a club that's doing things on the cheap?

Are they profiting from the club? Of course they are, and I would expect no less or any different.
They're businessmen and very good ones at that, and fact of the matter is (whether you or anyone else want to admit it or not) WE have also benefitted from them and their good business acumen - to the tune of an Anfield massive expansion and refurbishment project, a new state-of-the-art Training facility for both the senior team and the Academy.
Oh, and a couple of little other things known as Number 6 and Number 19 (after 30 long years).

I really don't get this notion of trying to paint them as the bad guys, when all it looks like is them trying to do right by us as much as they could.
Without them Klopp wouldn't be here. Klopp didn't hire himself.
And they've supported him to the hilt with everything he's needed on and off the field.

Perhaps some questions can be asked about transfer market decisions - especially in recent times - and while doing that we should also be honest enough to ask how much of Klopp's own stubbornness played a role in that too.

But I mean, please,...
Some reality and some perspective, guys.

Well said.

[justme]

Bit harsh on Mane. Beginning of the season he won us many points. He has dropped a few games. But today he was one of our better players.

Its not being harsh I just think hes not fully there at the minute. Maybe just a blip. But he needs to improve.

[HLOGI]

The thread has become about FSG and we overlooking key issues.

Roberto Firmino is the key issue. Klopp needs to drop him. Whether Jota is there or not. I rather have Mane through the middle, Ox wide and Salah. Or Jones, Salah and Mane as a rotating 3 until Jota is back. I will even take Minamino with Salah and Mane that is how bad Bobby has been over the last 16 months. He is running on reputation now and that is perhaps 2 or 3 golden years he had. The season Mane came up to 2019.

[skyebo]

I mean,.......surely those can't be the only two options (that either they're "perfect", which no one claimed nor pretended they are, or that they are complete shite and should fuck off).

Also, acting like or claiming that they're doing things on the cheap or don't want to spend is a little rich considering the fact that we have the world's most expensive (and best) defender in our squad, the world's second most expensive (and BEST) goalkeeper in our squad and the world's 4th highest paid player overall (in Mo, and only paid less than Messi, Ronaldo and Mbappe).
Does that sound to you like a club that's doing things on the cheap?

Are they profiting from the club? Of course they are, and I would expect no less or any different.
They're businessmen and very good ones at that, and fact of the matter is (whether you or anyone else want to admit it or not) WE have also benefitted from them and their good business acumen - to the tune of an Anfield massive expansion and refurbishment project, a new state-of-the-art Training facility for both the senior team and the Academy.
Oh, and a couple of little other things known as Number 6 and Number 19 (after 30 long years).

I really don't get this notion of trying to paint them as the bad guys, when all it looks like is them trying to do right by us as much as they could.
Without them Klopp wouldn't be here. Klopp didn't hire himself.
And they've supported him to the hilt with everything he's needed on and off the field.

Perhaps some questions can be asked about transfer market decisions - especially in recent times - and while doing that we should also be honest enough to ask how much of Klopp's own stubbornness played a role in that too.

But I mean, please,...
Some reality and some perspective, guys.

Great post Crimson.

[Nineteenx]

Bit harsh on Mane. Beginning of the season he won us many points. He has dropped a few games. But today he was one of our better players.

Very harsh on Mane, even though Jurgen has managed to play Mane, Mo and Bobby out of their early season form tinkering, Mane was still our best forward today, things that were seamless and done automatically last season aren't being done as they were or to the level they were this season, because we fucked about with them and disturbed important relationships and created uncertainty and hesitation where they wasn't any before or at the start of the season before those things were fucked about with

We have had a lot of injuries, but despite his brilliance, I think Jurgen panicked a little if i'm honest and changed a lot of things with the best players and relationships between them who were fit when he should have focused on our strengths and left them alone

[HLOGI]

Very harsh on Mane, even though Jurgen has managed to play Mane, Mo and Bobby out of their early season form tinkering, Mane was still our best forward today, things that were seamless and done automatically last season aren't being done as they were or to the level they were this season, because we fucked about with them and disturbed important relationships and created uncertainty and hesitation where they wasn't any before or at the start of the season before those things were fucked about with

This is 1 part you have said all along and I agree with you.

[Steveo]

How many goals have we scored this season from open play. Anyone know?

Be interesting know also to see who scored them and in what games.

[Crimson Dynasty]

Well said.

Great post Crimson.

Thanks.

FSG do have some things they should be held to account for, and I think they can still do some things better than they are now.
But there's no denying that their custodianship of the club has been a net positive overall for us fans and the club.

I for one have no problem freely admitting that at some point I truly did not believe I would ever see us lifting the title again in my lifetime.

And just for that alone (and them proving it wrong), they deserve the credit due to them for making that possible.

[RedNoodle]

I mean,.......surely those can't be the only two options (that either they're "perfect", which no one claimed nor pretended they are, or that they are complete shite and should fuck off).

Also, acting like or claiming that they're doing things on the cheap or don't want to spend is a little rich considering the fact that we have the world's most expensive (and best) defender in our squad, the world's second most expensive (and BEST) goalkeeper in our squad and the world's 4th highest paid player overall (in Mo, and only paid less than Messi, Ronaldo and Mbappe).
Does that sound to you like a club that's doing things on the cheap?

Are they profiting from the club? Of course they are, and I would expect no less or any different.
They're businessmen and very good ones at that, and fact of the matter is (whether you or anyone else want to admit it or not) WE have also benefitted from them and their good business acumen - to the tune of an Anfield massive expansion and refurbishment project, a new state-of-the-art Training facility for both the senior team and the Academy.
Oh, and a couple of little other things known as Number 6 and Number 19 (after 30 long years).

I really don't get this notion of trying to paint them as the bad guys, when all it looks like is them trying to do right by us as much as they could.
Without them Klopp wouldn't be here. Klopp didn't hire himself.
And they've supported him to the hilt with everything he's needed on and off the field.

Perhaps some questions can be asked about transfer market decisions - especially in recent times - and while doing that we should also be honest enough to ask how much of Klopp's own stubbornness played a role in that too.

But I mean, please,...
Some reality and some perspective, guys.

I've never said that they are one or the other. I've admitted that they've done some good things, but they have also done a number of things (both on and off the pitch) that I don't like and are currently causing us issues, which in my opinion could well get worse especially when Klopp leaves.

We have the world's most expensive defender and second most expensive goalkeeper because Barcelona were kind enough to pay a ludicrously inflated amount of money for Coutinho, never mind all the other money we've made from player sales to finance the likes of Mo and Jota. FSG did not go up to Jurgen, open up their wallet/cheque book and say "so Jurgen. How much money would you like from us so that you can build upon what you've already got?".

Yes our wages are not inconsequential, but that's because we've not only got some players on our books who are picking up a fair wedge despite not contributing quite a lot, but we've also got players like Milner who are on a huge wedge because we got them cheap/on a free, which sort of offsets our high wage bill that some like to bring up. I keep saying it but I'll say it again, we are the FIFTH richest club in the world, which should mean we are capable of spending a sizeable sum on fees AND wages, not just one or the other.

Yes they have done some good things, but they are doing so because it will end up benefiting them, not because they want to do these things out of the goodness of their heart. I understand how businesspeople work, but it's the fact that some are leaning more towards FSG doing things through the goodness of their heart/because they are great owners than I would like/than I personally think.

I still think they hired Klopp because of his record of doing things on the cheap. If there had been someone else who was even just a little bit as successful as he was, but were doing things on an even smaller budget, I fully believe that whoever that was, and not Klopp would have been hired.

Have FSG really provided Klopp with everything he needs? Hmmm. Our squad/bench tells me otherwise. If they had done what you say they have Klopp would not being having to use a load of young/untested players (some who many Reds have never heard of) in major games.

You have your view of the current situation and our owners, and I have mine. You say some reality and perspective are needed, and whilst I agree with others needing to get a grip on the first, I also say that people need to take on board who/what we are, who is running us, how they are running us, and why they are doing what they are doing.