Thiago - the future

[Steveo]

And it isn't fair to single out one player but IF there is a candidate - Naby Keïta must surely win the prize.

We haven't been at it much this season but when called upon - this really doesn't look good.

[IMG][/IMG]

Playing without Virgil and with Keita looks like a recipe for total disaster.

[Nineteenx]

We're talking about Thiago, not Virgil or Keita

Also you were unwilling to accept both Gomez and Fab had absolute meltdowns against Real even though both obviously did, with Gomez being by far the most culpable and the match thread showed that too, but here you are blaming other players to deflect from the Thiago debate

Playing with a designated playmaker we're slow and laboured and easy to press and our press and counter press dropped off to be nowhere near acceptable levels

So teams could nick the ball and go straight through us or play around and beat our press easily

Also, that doesn't just come back by Thiago being absent, because players get used to playing a certain way, it takes several games to get back, the second half v the filthy was the best it's been for a long time

[Steveo]

Ah so we cannot mention the inconvenient fact that were without Virgil for 3 and a half of that 4 game spell & that we were utilising want-away Keita.. Playing with 10 men effectively.

Ahh.. Silly me. I thought other players had an effect on the overall. Like when we played Real and Hendo was invisible, but not his fault because it was on Fabinho and Gomez..

Dude, it's clear that you are incapable of accepting reality.

[HLOGI]

Thiago is the best baller in our midfield. It is a myth that Thiago slows us down. He is also hard working and smart defensively,

He is the player you need when you lead, but can also carve open defenses. This current group has not had time to gel injuries or new faces etc plus loss of form to key starters, Salah, Van Dijk, Robbo, Trent, Fab, Hendo.

Imagine a silk passer like Thiago having 3 forwards who now know each other and have frightening pace what will happen?

Yes he is advancing in years, but when fit is a definite starter for me

[Nineteenx]

Thiago is the player you need when you lead, but can also carve open defenses

Your evidence?

Since he arrived Premier League

Thiago P63 Goals 2 Assists 4 Big chances created 7
2 of those assists from him playing a nothing short pass to Diaz, who then ran at the defence from in front of them not through being released, got half a yard and smashed the ball home

Henderson P78 Goals 3 Assists 6 Big chances created 12

Fabinho P82 Goals 5 Assists 1 Big chances created 2

All Fab's goals coming last season 2 of them pens 3 from corners, one a header the other 2 smashing in a ball knocked down from close range

The stats say Henderson is our most creative midfielder, creating more than Fab and Thiago combined as unpopular as that might be they also say that Thiago very rarely assists, or releases a player to assist or creates any big chances

[Nineteenx]

Henderson in the season BEFORE Thiago arrived

P30 W27 D2 L1 Goals 4 Assists 5 Big chances created 9

Seems to have been stifled considerably by Thiagos arrival no?

This is our concern Dude

I'll check Trent's stats after dinner, quite sure they have suffered a lot also since Thiago's arrival

[Steveo]

Yes and And Virgil Van Dijk played in EVERY SINGLE GAME FOR 90 MINUTES you loon. We also had a team in its Prime.


Oh...and also the title defence season we were in as good shape as the season before?

We hadn't just been in a marathon slog for 2 seasons straight? A season where we didn't lose for 27 games straight AND only dropped 2 points and on one single occasion - before dropping points on 5 occasions in the next 11 games? A period of time in which we also lost twice to Atletico Madrid. Oh no the team was going to operate at the same level again the following season wasn't it? Get outta town ya big biff.


Once again.. Title defence season..We didn't lose Virgil and all senior CB's? Just a fairytale.

No? That did not happen.. Yet even despite this - we managed to take 26 points from a possible 30.. and qualify higher than we will do this season.

And once again.. an equally incredible win percentage arrived last term with an ageing setup, Mane off form form one half of the season and Mo off form for the second half.. And with the AFCON in between.. Our most successful performance in the CL on reaching a final - almost making a quad.. BUT get this - Thiago is to blame..

Laughable

[darrenpotter]

Henderson in the season BEFORE Thiago arrived

P30 W27 D2 L1 Goals 4 Assists 5 Big chances created 9

Seems to have been stifled considerably by Thiagos arrival no?

This is our concern Dude

I'll check Trent's stats after dinner, quite sure they have suffered a lot also since Thiago's arrival

Good lad, take a break from your parents box room. Is mum doing fish fingers for dinner?

[Nineteenx]

A season where we didn't lose for 27 games straight AND only dropped 2 points and on one single occasion - before dropping points on 5 occasions in the next 11 games? A period of time in which we also lost twice to Atletico Madrid. Oh no the team was going to operate at the same level again the following season wasn't it? Get outta town ya big biff.

That was mostly down to Jurgen's fuck up brining Fab back in when we'd been the best we've ever been under Jurgen in his absence and Gomez playing at RCB instead of Matip

Mostly Fab, that Atletico game, the first one, where trent, Robbo and our forwards were all making the same runs they'd been making in his absence and he simply couldn't connect them and the amount of times he was letting our press get broken when it had been virtually impenetrable was absolutely criminal, absolutely criminal Hendo picked up a hamstring injury in that game having to do 4 or 5 30 yard sprints through Fab letting the press get broken

The only Prem game Hendo lost that season was the away game v City after the title was won and without him at No6 our game had gone to shit in his absence, funnily the opposite of our current situation with Thiago

[Nineteenx]

I will say again for the record in case anyone believes otherwise, I think Thiago is an fantastic player, I just don't think he suits how we play and we absolutely should not have ever tried to employ him as a designated playmaker, it just takes too much away from us as a team and I believe we've seen that

For me he's better in a slightly slower less physical league like La Liga or the Bundesliga and in a 4231 where he can look to find the forward, the No10 or either attacking mid with his trademark balls through the lines

We don't have the players to play a 4231, we've recruited wide/inside forwards suited to making runs in behind and playing on defenders shoulders, it would take too much of what our full backs offer us away too, he was always a weird signing for me

For me we needed a player who could play high quality switches, balls over the top and long diagonals, as those balls play to all our strengths and team so often completely crowd the centre against us with low blocks, we bypassed those best with high quality quickly up and down switches, medium to long diagonals and balls over the top, even over the top of defenders camping on their 18 yard line - Those balls are all the type of passes Thiago isn't actually good at

Fantastic player, just never the right players for us, the rest of our players our set up and our strengths