Champions League and Premier League winning 433 versus the 343 tweak box midfield

[CCTV]

But he didn't stick to it, he tried to instill a midfield playmaker and push both LCM and RCM forward

He played the LCM controller in 2 games, we won those games 9-0 and 7-0

Gini wasn't routinely our furthest forward mid at all, he drove the ball forward sometimes, he sprang forward to get a good counter pressing position and one he could potentially get involved in the attack from in support of Mane and Robbo on others

Our right side has almost always ben the side we employed our attacking mid of the 3 Ketia, Shaqiri, Oxlade, Lallana, Minamino, it usually only 'really' worked if Hendo played at No6 though

I tend to watch out for average positions, on average Gini was our furthest forward midfielder and played on the left.
Coutinho played lcm under Klopp in 433 in a far more attacking role.

Our midfiled shape has altered from game to game and selection to selection, sometimes a flat midfield 3, sometimes a v shape with a 6 and two in front, and post Gini a more apparent pushing forward of our rcm.
The Hendo ZZ role, a lad who in some games was as far forward as Mane on average positions, a tactical tweak that saw Klopp select Elliott do deputise/cover/replace Hendos new role.

In the city v Madrid game, the pummelling of Real. On average positions City played a 334 (a tweaked shape on a 4231 selection) versus Madrids 4222.

Grealish Halaand KdB Silva
Gundogan Rodri Stones
Akanji Diaz Walker
.........Ederson

https://www.whoscored.com/Matches/1724206/MatchReport/Europe-Champions-League-2022-2023-Manchester-City-Real-Madrid

According to you, were we to mimic City, who are mimicking us at our very best with Gini... we'd be back to playing 433 at our very best by mimicking city/ourselves by playing 343 !!

We'd see us playing a 4231 selection in a 334 shape, just like we did in years gone by playing 433 with a lcm controller

Shape:
Diaz Nunez Gakpo Salah
Fab Hendo Trent
Robbo VVD Konate
.............Alison

[Nineteenx]

I watch games to see who is our furthest forward mid in the true sense of being and determine the roles and actions they are performing, you need to watch the game more, you're overly reliant of stats sites for your opinions

We did play a lot of switches and long diagonals to Mane and Robbo, that Gini often came forward to support/take a counter pressing position, there were also lots of passage of play when Robbo was furthest forward well beyond Gini, a hell of a lot, and if/when the opposition tried to break, Gini was there supporting Virgil deeper than Fab or RCM

Gini was very frequently found helping Virgil out with opposition players deep in our left corner, far more frequently than RCM, RCM quite often kept more of a half way line or just beyond position, so perhaps the frequency of Gini driving the ball forward or pushing forward to support our diagonals and switches to Mane and Robbo somehow shows him as the highest player on average positions, but the average position your sites show him having isn't at all representative of how he actually played for us, not even remotely, again revealing the flaws in your views of the game revolving entirely around stats sites

I watched the City v Real game, City didn't play that formation, average position maps are a floored tool, if a wide midfielder mostly playing in a 3, makes quite a few runs to the byline in between sitting deeper in the 3 in their starting position, for whatever reason, the average position maps show them as playing up top all game. City pretty much played 3331, the 2 wide forwards made lots of runs in behind or to the byline from their position in the 3, but to say that their formation was 334 simply isn't accurate

[Nineteenx]

The Hendo ZZ role, a lad who in some games was as far forward as Mane on average positions, a tactical tweak that saw Klopp select Elliott do deputise/cover/replace Hendos new role.

That was entirely in your head, again average positions are incredibly misleading, they are not reliable, Hendo's role was not of a No10 as it has become in the Trent tweak, which I still think is wrong and it should be Mo in that position with RCM keeping the width deeper, last season he was an attacking No8 facilitator, he Trent and Mo worked the space and moved opposition players brilliantly between them with the aim predominantly being to release Mo or Trent and it worked brilliantly, it was always lunacy to suggest that role was a No10 last season, it was a very specific role in a triangle of 3 between Trent Mo and Hendo

Elliott could never be a replacement in that role, that we're not even playing it now, because he hasn't anything like Hendo's know how and game intelligence, whereas Hendo helped work the space brilliantly between Mo and Trent, Elliott is absolutely fucking clueless and spent over half this season getting in the way and space of both, one of the features of that triangle required Hendo to go wide right to receive the ball to go back to Trent for a first time cross or low cross whipped through the channel his position had opened, to make runs to open that channel and to be released wide right looking to cross, Elliott has no right foot, opposition players know he has no right foot - A great deal of that role was about opening the channel and closing the channel for the benefit of Mo and Trent, Elliott hasn't the game intelligence to do that

[CCTV]

I watch games to see who is our furthest forward mid in the true sense of being and determine the roles and actions they are performing, you need to watch the game more, you're overly reliant of stats sites for your opinions

We did play a lot of switches and long diagonals to Mane and Robbo, that Gini often came forward to support/take a counter pressing position, there were also lots of passage of play when Robbo was furthest forward well beyond Gini, a hell of a lot, and if/when the opposition tried to break, Gini was there supporting Virgil deeper than Fab or RCM

Gini was very frequently found helping Virgil out with opposition players deep in our left corner, far more frequently than RCM, RCM quite often kept more of a half way line or just beyond position, so perhaps the frequency of Gini driving the ball forward or pushing forward to support our diagonals and switches to Mane and Robbo somehow shows him as the highest player on average positions, but the average position your sites show him having isn't at all representative of how he actually played for us, not even remotely, again revealing the flaws in your views of the game revolving entirely around stats sites

I watched the City v Real game, City didn't play that formation, average position maps are a floored tool, if a wide midfielder mostly playing in a 3, makes quite a few runs to the byline in between sitting deeper in the 3 in their starting position, for whatever reason, the average position maps show them as playing up top all game. City pretty much played 3331, the 2 wide forwards made lots of runs in behind or to the byline from their position in the 3, but to say that their formation was 334 simply isn't accurate

Average positions are based on telemetry data from GPS trackers on football players.
It is a sound mathematical calculation. It provides heat maps etc

With ourselves, Gini was typically the furthest forward midfielder. You can see this based on the telemetry data.

With our attack, Salah has routinely been our furthest forward player on the rightside.

Essentially we played a slanted front 3 with Salah furthest forward.
...........................Salah
............Bobby
Mane

Or we played a 1-2 front 3

........................Salah
Mane
................Bobby


With regards City the other night you can see their front 4 essentially in a flat enough forward line.

[Nineteenx]

It isn't accurate, it doesn't accurately show the true position a player has played, if a player at say RCM, make lots of run to almost the corner flag to take the full back away to open the channel from the time spent making that run, to the time taken running back to the position he is actually playing, it will inevitably, very obviously show the player playing further forward than where they have actually been playing, it is surely a very basuc thing to understand

Look

Player start position TRUE position


Player average position shown
Or Even higher depending on time taken to return to start position

Players end of run position

The tracker is always going to show a player making constant runs average position higher than where there true position has been, as above

If you have a lot of set pieces, given the time it takes for them to be taken and the player positions while waiting for that to happen, it's also going to skew their actual position

[redebreck]

On the Liverpool echo website, I believe, Elliott is one of four players put forward for LFCplayer of the season.
The others being Mo, Trent and Allisson.
I'll have whatever they're smoking.

[Nineteenx]

On the Liverpool echo website, I believe, Elliott is one of four players put forward for LFCplayer of the season.
The others being Mo, Trent and Allisson.
I'll have whatever they're smoking.

They've been on Jurgen's crack pipe if Elliott is being given undue praise, what a fucking joke, one of the 3 players responsible, with Jurgen, for wrecking our season and he's on that fucking list

The candidates are Alisson and THAT is the end of the list, Elliott though