Brexit thread 2 Electric Boogaloo

[CCTV]

To be fair CCTV, I think for a large portion of its young people the EU has achieved a number of those things.

There's not been a war between EU countries since its inception, France and Germany are basically married now instead of each other's throats and the union has made it a lot easier to live, study and travel abroad. I've also heard it's pretty good for science.

The trauma of ww2 played a big part. There are a few years of a void without war for example iirc.

War and arms have been exported outside of the region. Theres not a single country that's had a terrorist attack in Europe without having had military intervention abroad.

I'd also argue that the us in terms of a militarily dominant force has played a part in maintaining peace in Europe. Our armies know that a conflict were it to occur would be wiped out against the United states. They've warmongered for sure but they did intervene in Kosovo.

I dont think the argument is robust enough that the eu is essential or necessary for maintaining peace. For example if trade of goods was so important why would they be provoking Britain a nuclear power with tough trade terms.

Also on science, re global warming the yanks have the same carbon footprint as 10,000,000,000 3rd world persons. We are similar with a bigger population and slightly less of a carbon footprint per person.
Whites make up about 12% of the global population and contribute a carbon footprint equal to 20,000,000,000 3rd world persons. It would seem a rather unethical standard for the scientific community to stand over in principle and global wealth terms a 55% share resides in Europe and USA.

We're getting into big areas now though of discussion. I find it odd how we love science produces, like smokers ,but seem unaware of the related effects on health.

Over here we had the Atlantic documentary, very nice cinematography, which shows a terrible management of our finishing stocks. Flat fish have been shown to be a very useful tool in combating climate change and acidity in the ocean but very poor management of the resource.
Similarly a shell to sea documentary showed an estuary protected by EU law and it was illegal for you or I to move one shovel of sand in it, so as to protect salmon stocks.
Shell come in and get permission to dig a 9m? Trench to run a pipe through it. Envrionemental protection meets corporate interests. EU says go for it.

[dicko1969]

Next up

Demographics

Now in the 1970s I'm guessing 2.4 children per family in Blighty.

Recent times , you'll need to check, as low as 1.2 children.

Ageing population, baby boomers, just after the war , living longer putting extreme strains on nhs, services, and so on.

Coupled with the fact that to be a university graduate you need £45k+ to become a nurse, doctor, and so on.

So where do you get the qualified people.

Elsewhere.

Britain needs migration. Always has always will. And especiallywith the above stats.

[CCTV]

Countries such as your Ireland have got richer. 6th in the world.

Czech republic has improved vastly.
Due to Europe.

Reducing our corporate tax rate played it's part. The eu played it part and the peace process played a huge part imo. FDI from the states. We produce lots of pharmaceuticals. Tourism and I'd wager our 80million Americans who claim to be Irish had a part too. 1 in 6 euros comes from corporate tax money being filtered through here iirc today.

It's a big question you're asking. Inflation plays a part, when I was 16 a house was maybe 30,000 when I was 25 twas 300,000. Same house, different property bubble.
We too though have become a more unequal society in terms of financial inequality.

[dicko1969]

Britain population has grown

Year 2000 approx 59million
Year 2018 approx 69million

10 million more people
Net migration 1.5 million

So a crude calculation means the baby boomers and ageing population make up 8.5 million extra people in the UK

[CCTV]

Next up

Demographics

Now in the 1970s I'm guessing 2.4 children per family in Blighty.

Recent times , you'll need to check, as low as 1.2 children.

Ageing population, baby boomers, just after the war , living longer putting extreme strains on nhs, services, and so on.

Coupled with the fact that to be a university graduate you need £45k+ to become a nurse, doctor, and so on.

So where do you get the qualified people.

Elsewhere.

Britain needs migration. Always has always will. And especiallywith the above stats.

A means to an end. Interesting perspective on outsourcing and very true imo.

I saw a remain campaigner talking about how they needed foreigners to fill the NHS. Especially in home help. A 'native' woman in this area was talking about the lack of Brits willing to do these jobs.
The pay and work conditions are not good enough to entice Brits to care for vulnerable people. Another consequence of widening inequality, despite how empathetic people profess themselves to be on social media, there are declining levels of actual empathy per college graduate generation.
Narcissism rises and empathy declines with widening inequality gaps.

I've blurred as much as I can for today.

[dicko1969]

Are house prices CCTV

Another point
I remember in the early 2000 people in the UK saying my house worth this or worth that.

It only has better value if you trade your house for another in Bulgaria.

Who benefits from this? Banks. Plain and simple. Banks lend more money you pay more interest.

Second London, half is owned by China.

What I mean here is it is a bit like owning a football club Mr Abramovic . Sure value. Healthy market.

This creates a false, unfair market.

Similarly many tourists, Brits coming to Spain or France overinflated house prices for the local people. They couldn't afford and got driven out of their towns.

[dicko1969]

A means to an end. Interesting perspective on outsourcing and very true imo.

I saw a remain campaigner talking about how they needed foreigners to fill the NHS. Especially in home help. A 'native' woman in this area was talking about the lack of Brits willing to do these jobs.
The pay and work conditions are not good enough to entice Brits to care for vulnerable people. Another consequence of widening inequality, despite how empathetic people profess themselves to be on social media, there are declining levels of actual empathy per college graduate generation.
Narcissism rises and empathy declines with widening inequality gaps.

I've blurred as much as I can for today.

Yep another valid point.
This is the case in other wealthy European countries.
Immigrants (I hate this term) taking our jobs. Bullshit , people too lazy to work.

The average EEA migrant arriving in 2016 will contribute a discounted total of around £78,000 to the UK public finances over his or her lifetime.

Overall, the future net contribution of 2016 arrivals alone to the UK public finances is estimated at £25bn.

Had there been no immigration at all in 2016, the rest of us would have had, over time, to find £25bn, through higher taxes, public service cuts, or higher borrowing.

[Balinkay]

Ok, CC. Gave the inequality video a watch. Very enlightening. Actually remembered I might have seen it years ago. Some points smell somewhat fishy and it's TED, so I automatically approach it with a pinch of salt, but it was very informative. Cheers!

Think it shows pretty clearly that countries with a large healthy and wealthy middle class (not as in rich, which is what I think that means in England, but as in "in the middle"), such as Germany and Denmark do well.

[ianlfc]

The bigger question I want to know is , who are the fucking headers who stand outside the houses of parliament protesting and shouting at reporters ?

[Aldo1988]

The biggest question is who is going to do all the jobs the 'immigrants' did that the lazy dole dwelling wouldnt do?