Other games June 2022

[justme]

Disagree, think the rules are fairly clear and people just simply forget the rules.

Yeah when it suits the officials

[Nineteenx]

Disagree, think the rules are fairly clear and people just simply forget the rules.

The rules on handball are exceptionally clear, yet our lads missed out on the Premier League title through officials, including a VAR official with the benefit of numerous replays from numerous angles twice deliberately failing to apply the laws of the game

The rules on offside aren't clear, different leagues have different interpretations of when to raise the flag and when not to

My understanding from watching a lot of Premier League games this season is that officials flag immediately only if the player is very clearly offside when the ball is played, Kane was very clearly offside

ANd another aspect commentators, who may well have it wrong, always mention is that in instances such as Kane's, if they haven't flagged, they should flag immediately when it is clear that he is going after and going to attempt to play the ball

[Nineteenx]

Offside offence

A player in an offside position at the moment the ball is played or touched* by a team-mate is only penalised on becoming involved in active play by:

interfering with play by playing or touching a ball passed or touched by a team-mate or
interfering with an opponent by:

preventing an opponent from playing or being able to play the ball by clearly obstructing the opponent’s line of vision or
challenging an opponent for the ball Benzema in the Champions League final

clearly attempting to play a ball which is close when this action impacts on an opponent or
making an obvious action which clearly impacts on the ability of an opponent to play the ball Kane last night, so very clearly offside

[CCTV]

Offside offence

A player in an offside position at the moment the ball is played or touched* by a team-mate is only penalised on becoming involved in active play by:

interfering with play by playing or touching a ball passed or touched by a team-mate or
interfering with an opponent by:

preventing an opponent from playing or being able to play the ball by clearly obstructing the opponent’s line of vision or
challenging an opponent for the ball Benzema in the Champions League final

clearly attempting to play a ball which is close when this action impacts on an opponent or
making an obvious action which clearly impacts on the ability of an opponent to play the ball Kane last night, so very clearly offside

A) It is not an offence to be in an offside position.

B) a player in an offside position is moving towards the ball with the intention of playing the ball and is fouled before playing or attempting to play the ball, or challenging an opponent for the ball, the foul is penalised as it has occurred before the offside offence

You'll find Benzema prevented no-one from making any efforts to play the ball, nor did Kane - who failed to meet the ball himself.

[Nineteenx]

A) It is not an offence to be in an offside position.

B) a player in an offside position is moving towards the ball with the intention of playing the ball and is fouled before playing or attempting to play the ball, or challenging an opponent for the ball, the foul is penalised as it has occurred before the offside offence

You'll find Benzema prevented no-one from making any efforts to play the ball, nor did Kane - who failed to meet the ball himself.

Lol, Kane's running towards the ball trying to get to it and play it very fucking clearly obstructing the German defender from getting to the ball to clear it, so at the point he is doing that, which is prior to the defender allegedly fouling him, he's off fucking side

Benzema's position clearly obstructed both Konate's and Trent's line of site of the ball, he checks by stepping slightly backwards to let the ball almost run over his toes really late, Konate and Trent can't see that ball until he steps back out of his offside position to leave it, so he was preventing an opponent (2 of them) from being able to play the ball by clearly obstructing the opponents line of vision - If they don't disallow that goal using the laws as they are written and that's not what they mean, they need to rewrite it then, as in plain English, he was offside by their definition

Where is (B) In your post from? I went to the FA site and read through and was looking for it, but couldn't find it

[CCTV]

Lol, Kane's running towards the ball trying to get to it and play it very fucking clearly obstructing the German defender from getting to the ball to clear it, so at the point he is doing that, which is prior to the defender allegedly fouling him, he's off fucking side

Benzema's position clearly obstructed both Konate's and Trent's line of site of the ball, he checks by stepping slightly backwards to let the ball almost run over his toes really late, Konate and Trent can't see that ball until he steps back out of his offside position to leave it, so he was preventing an opponent (2 of them) from being able to play the ball by clearly obstructing the opponents line of vision - If they don't disallow that goal using the laws as they are written and that's not what they mean, they need to rewrite it then, as in plain English, he was offside by their definition

Where is (B) In your post from? I went to the FA site and read through and was looking for it, but couldn't find it

B) is from thefa.com link posted on the previous page regarding offside
Under the heading: in situations where

A lot of confusion around offside calls outside of crooked referee insinuations (stating not contesting) is understanding the wording

The offside goal real had ruled out.
People argued that it should have stood as the ball hits off one of our defenders, a bit like the Kane v Lovren goal years back.
However closer to goal a play can be classified as a stop, which doesn't count, and a next phase of play hasn't occurred meaning he could not play the ball technically.

With Kane had he been closer to playing the ball, making a play, then the ruling might have been different. In that case an obstruction might have mattered.
This occurred before for us with an offside Bobby leaping to head a ball, a defender was drawn to him but Bobby did not clearly impede his opponent. The ball flew over both and came to IcantRecall maybe ox who slammed home.
In this instant the offside Bobby attempted to play the ball but missed it. Didn't impede anyone, from making a play.
Had the defender been closer to Bobby or jumping for the ball and had his sight obstructed it would be given against Bobby.

Benzema runs offside attempting to play the ball, a routine feature of set piece attacks. Offside runner distracts keeper and defence might even be playing them offside. An onside runner comes through and scores.
The offside player clearly needs to obstruct another player from playing the ball.

Clearly/material/physical obstruct etc are distinct from mentally distract, steal focus, partially

Benzema is offside, attempts to play the ball but doesn't clearly obstruct any opponent. He doesn't touch the ball.
Vincinius ghosts in behind and finishes as he has followed the ball best.

[Nineteenx]

B) is from thefa.com link posted on the previous page regarding offside
Under the heading: in situations where

A lot of confusion around offside calls outside of crooked referee insinuations (stating not contesting) is understanding the wording

The offside goal real had ruled out.
People argued that it should have stood as the ball hits off one of our defenders, a bit like the Kane v Lovren goal years back.
However closer to goal a play can be classified as a stop, which doesn't count, and a next phase of play hasn't occurred meaning he could not play the ball technically.

With Kane had he been closer to playing the ball, making a play, then the ruling might have been different. In that case an obstruction might have mattered.
This occurred before for us with an offside Bobby leaping to head a ball, a defender was drawn to him but Bobby did not clearly impede his opponent. The ball flew over both and came to IcantRecall maybe ox who slammed home.
In this instant the offside Bobby attempted to play the ball but missed it. Didn't impede anyone, from making a play.
Had the defender been closer to Bobby or jumping for the ball and had his sight obstructed it would be given against Bobby.

Benzema runs offside attempting to play the ball, a routine feature of set piece attacks. Offside runner distracts keeper and defence might even be playing them offside. An onside runner comes through and scores.
The offside player clearly needs to obstruct another player from playing the ball.

Clearly/material/physical obstruct etc are distinct from mentally distract, steal focus, partially

Benzema is offside, attempts to play the ball but doesn't clearly obstruct any opponent. He doesn't touch the ball.
Vincinius ghosts in behind and finishes as he has followed the ball best.

Benzema's position stops both Konate and Trent seeing the ball, them not being able to play it as a result because it is driven low and at the speed it is driven, by the time they see it, Benzema standing offside having prevented them seeing it, they can't play it, clearly offside

Preventing an opponent from playing or being able to play the ball by clearly obstructing the opponent’s line of vision

Vlaverde played that ball on the exact line Benzema was standing offside, he is between Vlaverde and Konate and Trent in an offside position that clearly stops both players seeing the ball and makes them unable to play it, it's offside, according to the laws of the game

Kane is offside under the laws of the game as I described earlier, he initiates contact with a defender he is preventing from trying to get to the ball and play it, it's offside

[CCTV]

Benzema's position stops both Konate and Trent seeing the ball, them not being able to play it as a result because it is driven low and at the speed it is driven, by the time they see it, Benzema standing offside having prevented them seeing it, they can't play it, clearly offside

Preventing an opponent from playing or being able to play the ball by clearly obstructing the opponent’s line of vision

Vlaverde played that ball on the exact line Benzema was standing offside, he is between Vlaverde and Konate and Trent in an offside position that clearly stops both players seeing the ball and makes them unable to play it, it's offside, according to the laws of the game

Kane is offside under the laws of the game as I described earlier, he initiates contact with a defender he is preventing from trying to get to the ball and play it, it's offside

Here's what actually happens.

Benzema makes a run pulling Konate with him via the run.
Konate stops his run to play Benzema offside. The ball comes in and Konate having played Benzema offside, makes no attempt to play the ball.
A miskick, play or attempt to play, by Konate could play Benzema onside after all.

Perhaps Konate might have tried to play the ball and taken the risk of a miskick dropping to Benzema now onside, but he didn't make any attempt to play the ball in the end. Happy his man is offside essentially.
Benzema knowing he's offside doesn't touch the ball.
The ball comes through unimpeded and little Vinny taps home. Trent also playing offside and switched off to Vinnys run.

Some good angles which show the goal back.
https://youtu.be/zad4nTmAFoU

It's a strategy that's part of set piece routines. Near post runner acting as a marker for the crosser.
An offside player leading defenders to switch off and bang an onside runner scores.

[Nineteenx]

I've seen it from all the angles, I'm very aware of the set piece use of the runner, but Benzema is obstructing the view of Konate and Trent, we could debate whether or not Konate's vision is obscured, but not Trent's for me, it's offside, you can see Trent trying to see the ball and he can't, then Benzema moves backwards to let it go past him and it comes so quickly he doesn't have time to react to it

We'll just have to agree to disagree on this, for me, Trent isn't so much switched off to Vinicius' run, he is pre-occupied with trying to see any ball coming in, he can't see it for Benzema (offside) Benzema moves out of the way, it comes so quickly he can't react, his line of sight of the ball in having been blocked by Benzema

Preventing an opponent from playing or being able to play the ball by clearly obstructing the opponent’s line of vision

Whatever you say, I won't see it any other way, Benzema is blocking Trent's line of sight, very clearly

[CCTV]

Vincinius made a movement sufficient to get on the end of the play.

At the beginning of the pass Trent hasn't moved in time to track Vinny,
At the point Benzema is supposed to clearly obstructs his vision he's not in a position to intercept the pass to Vinny.
It was too late, Vinny had gone and Trent held an offside line.