Captain

[jozza800]

I hope anyone who says Henderson can't pass a ball was watching the last two matches. He's played 3 or 4 absolute peaches for our forwards.

He's certainly more than just a crab.

[miller0863]

Don’t forget the cross to Robbo at Palace

[Insidious]

i hope anyone who says henderson can't pass a ball was watching the last two matches. He's played 3 or 4 absolute peaches for our forwards.

He's certainly more than just a crab.

geordie jumpers!!!

[jozza800]

He certainly wouldn't like being called a geordie, being a mackam.

[teesred]

I hope anyone who says Henderson can't pass a ball was watching the last two matches. He's played 3 or 4 absolute peaches for our forwards.

He's certainly more than just a crab.
Good post and timely. Hes a great player.

[Insidious]

He certainly wouldn't like being called a geordie, being a mackam.

"Where'd ye get her jumper like? Ah quite like it!"

[southernboy]

From the BBC:

The Liverpool captain was a colossus in midfield, dominating the play and bringing energy to the game. He had more touches than anybody else (160), played more passes (150) and provided the most in the opposition half (79). His assist for Oxlade-Chamberlain's goal topped things off.

[Joetan991]

Yes he has 1 goal 2 assists so far, Keita has 1 goal and 1 assist, they are definitely better than KDB of man city because we r Liverpool

[Balinkay]

He's been great. A more advanced role is what he was bought for and he's showing it.

[eggy81]

Yes he has 1 goal 2 assists so far, Keita has 1 goal and 1 assist, they are definitely better than KDB of man city because we r Liverpool

14 points better actually thus far.

[Steveo]

He's been great. A more advanced role is what he was bought for and he's showing it.

He has improved and has now got that most important formula of all - confidence. Makes a world of difference. IMO he has gone from a squad player to being integral to our strongest side ( never thought I would say that ) AND from what was a very underwhelming captain to one who leads by example.. He has finally emerged from the shadow of Gerrard.

Yet again - this could be put down to Klopp and his management - however I believe even on this score - Hendo must take the credit.. Didn’t he tell Jurgen to play him differently..? If so it speaks volumes for the quality of both men.

[Balinkay]

He did say that Steveo. I think he wasn't at his best as a DM - in 13/14 he was Gerrard's legs and the experience from that campaign + the time he spent at DM are helping him become Trent's defender until the young man shifts position or learns a thing or two from Andy.

I really like how our captain is being used at present.

[Aldo1988]

I hope anyone who says Henderson can't pass a ball was watching the last two matches. He's played 3 or 4 absolute peaches for our forwards.

He's certainly more than just a crab.

Horrenderson

[Aldo1988]

Yes he has 1 goal 2 assists so far, Keita has 1 goal and 1 assist, they are definitely better than KDB of man city because we r Liverpool

And Jonjo?

[teesred]

And Jonjo?

Shelvery.

[Steveo]

Might be putting up the Shelves BUT - he just scored his 3rd goal in 3 games - seems to be going through a purple patch..... :D

[Nineteenx]

I hope anyone who says Henderson can't pass a ball was watching the last two matches. He's played 3 or 4 absolute peaches for our forwards.

He's certainly more than just a crab.

Entirely agree, fantastic player and captain

[Joetan991]

Lovren should play c midfielder too, his pass to origin is the best long pass so far

[shminkyred]

He has improved and has now got that most important formula of all - confidence. Makes a world of difference. IMO he has gone from a squad player to being integral to our strongest side ( never thought I would say that ) AND from what was a very underwhelming captain to one who leads by example.. He has finally emerged from the shadow of Gerrard.

Yet again - this could be put down to Klopp and his management - however I believe even on this score - Hendo must take the credit.. Didn’t he tell Jurgen to play him differently..? If so it speaks volumes for the quality of both men.

I really don't understand how people cant see that every single manager picks him........and they pick him because he carries out theirinstructions to the letter......In his previous role under Klopp when he was getting the most stick Klopp kept him as captain and constantly picked him..must have been doing something right at that stage..............now Klopp has found him a different role and he excells at that.....Maybe we donn't know as much as we think we do

[Aldo1988]

I really don't understand how people cant see that every single manager picks him........and they pick him because he carries out theirinstructions to the letter......In his previous role under Klopp when he was getting the most stick Klopp kept him as captain and constantly picked him..must have been doing something right at that stage..............now Klopp has found him a different role and he excells at that.....Maybe we donn't know as much as we think we do

He's underrated by our fans as he's not a 'sexy' enough player.

[shminkyred]

He's underrated by our fans as he's not a 'sexy' enough player.

after seeing him cry on his dads shoulder he definitely gets a Man Crush vote from me.....lolol

[Nineteenx]

Hendo's been immense the last few games, his range and variety of forward passing from DM has vastly improved, he's played some absolute belters

[Nineteenx]

Captain fantastic lifts a trophy no other Liverpool captain has ever lifted with a MOTM display, WHAT an absolute legend

He's the perfect captain, people won't like this, but for me he's a far superior captain to Gerrard, Stevie was a more attacking midfielder who scored great goals and bailed us out time and time again and an absolute legend in the absence of players like so many of the one's we have now, a brilliant player, I prefer Hendo because he is ALL about the team, he organises, he quietly gets the job done and holds everything together, he doesn't want the limelight or personal glory, he just strives in every single performance to do everything he possibly can to help out in all areas of the pitch to make sure we get the wins

[jozza800]

Captain fantastic lifts a trophy no other Liverpool captain has ever lifted with a MOTM display, WHAT an absolute legend

He's the perfect captain, people won't like this, but for me he's a far superior captain to Gerrard, Stevie was a more attacking midfielder who scored great goals and bailed us out time and time again and an absolute legend in the absence of players like so many of the one's we have now, a brilliant player, I prefer Hendo because he is ALL about the team, he organises, he quietly gets the job done and holds everything together, he doesn't want the limelight or personal glory, he just strives in every single performance to do everything he possibly can to help out in all areas of the pitch to make sure we get the wins

I love Hendo as much as the next guy (I did start the thread) but captaincy in general is load of bollocks. VVD, Milner, Robbo or even Trent would make decent captains. As good as Hendo is stamina/endurance aside there isn't any part of his game as good as Gerrard's.

[miller0863]

What a game from our skipper AGAIN yesterday. We certainly miss him when he’s not in our starting line up these days, whether in at No6 or pushing further up on the right. All energy driving us on, often leading the press but also with great vision to pick a defence splitting pass.
To think he was going to be a makeweight in a deal with Fulham for whatshisface. What a turnaround, so much respect for the guy.

[eggy81]

What a game from our skipper AGAIN yesterday. We certainly miss him when he’s not in our starting line up these days, whether in at No6 or pushing further up on the right. All energy driving us on, often leading the press but also with great vision to pick a defence splitting pass.
To think he was going to be a makeweight in a deal with Fulham for whatshisface. What a turnaround, so much respect for the guy.

Clint Dempsey 🤔

[miller0863]

Indeed, was making the point that he never really did anything of note after our attempt to bring him in, whereas Hendo ...

[Steveo]

Hendo's been immense the last few games, his range and variety of forward passing from DM has vastly improved, he's played some absolute belters

Agreed - it isn't just in a more forward role where he is excelling - he even played perfectly well at CB. Klopp has opened up what was previously hidden in Hendo - who is now every inch a captain - he is actually becoming a talisman...! Never in a million years did I think that would ever be the case.

His confidence is off the scale.. Different player

[shminkyred]

I love Hendo as much as the next guy (I did start the thread) but captaincy in general is load of bollocks. VVD, Milner, Robbo or even Trent would make decent captains. As good as Hendo is stamina/endurance aside there isn't any part of his game as good as Gerrard's.

Does anyone remember a few years back when it seemed there was no one in the squad that had big enough huevos to take over the arm band....Kinda agree with 19 though.....the rest of the team had to live up to the legend and genius of Stevie G ......but with Hendo its respect for pure hard work ...and the fact he keeps on coming back when he knows half the fan base think he's crap...

[Steveo]

Klopp has to take credit too for letting Hendo suggest a different position.. That was surely the catalyst...?

How many managers have such a lack of ego that they would allow that?

[miller0863]

Yep

[teesred]

Klopp has to take credit too for letting Hendo suggest a different position.. That was surely the catalyst...?

How many managers have such a lack of ego that they would allow that?

Yep. Thats why hes such an amazing manager. Doesnt see it as me and them, its a collective of everyone and thats why we are seeing success now and going forward.
The guys the best in the world.

[CCTV]

Klopp has to take credit too for letting Hendo suggest a different position.. That was surely the catalyst...?

How many managers have such a lack of ego that they would allow that?

Klopp, 19, myself & Dicko.





On second thoughts scrap dicko, he's an egomaniacal loon :D

[Steveo]

Sorry fellas I forgot to credit you..

[vin]

I really don't understand how people cant see that every single manager picks him.......

The Lucas argument.

On Hendo, he's playing very well at the moment. Long may it continue. Needs to pitch in with goals and assists

[skyebo]

Benitez did the same thing with Jamie Carragher, he was flipping positions at full back under Houllier and not outstanding in either. Benitez comes in and puts him at centre back and we all know how good he was playing there.

[southernboy]

Excellent again last night. I just wish his brilliant strike had gone in. Would have topped off a fantastic performance.

[Balinkay]

Klopp has to take credit too for letting Hendo suggest a different position.. That was surely the catalyst...?

How many managers have such a lack of ego that they would allow that?

Good point. But it's also worth mentioning Hendo was never meant to play DM when we signed him. That was never the position he was intended for, nor the one where he performed best.

[Steveo]

I thought he was bought to play in the midfield...? I don’t buy this he was bought as an AM.. if he was whoever decided that should be fired...? Oh yes he was.. :D

He isn’t a Coutinho or a David Silva - he isn’t a playmaker, lacks the shooting ability and doesn’t dribble IMO - he has to be adaptable - this was the big issue really, not quite good enough as an AM and not effective enough as a DM - he was struggling for games by last Spring - Keita hadn’t shown enough and yet he was still struggling for starts - he has stepped up to the plate. Had words with Jurgen who gave him a chance in his favoured role and he has done him proud.

But he looks far better when playing deeper now too. Even looked capable at CB. He has become what he always needed to. He isn’t blessed with greatest talent TBF. - but is honest as the day is long, hard working and has crafted what he has to be effective. His biggest strengths were always his stamina and his passing BUT often he got it wrong..lacking the confidence to play the killer ball often in favour of passing the buck.

Emerged from the shadow of Gerrard finally.

Something has happened - the confidence is flowing and especially since lifting the CL - we see a totally different player..

Just my opinion though

[Balinkay]

He was bought as a box-to-box midfielder who could fill in on the wing or at DM. He was immense in 2014 when he actually played in his preferred role. He was shite on the wing under Kenny and not completely ideal at DM under Klopp.

Hell, Gerrard could fill in at DM but it was clear it wasn't his best ever position.

[Steveo]

He was bought as a box-to-box midfielder who could fill in on the wing or at DM. He was immense in 2014 when he actually played in his preferred role. He was shite on the wing under Kenny and not completely ideal at DM under Klopp.

Hell, Gerrard could fill in at DM but it was clear it wasn't his best ever position.

All true.. and in that regard over the duration of his near 9 years at the club he has been played in all of those roles.

As for 2014 - Let’s be honest here Victor Moses looked a world beater in that team. Sturridge - Suarez - Sterling - Coutinho plus Stevie G... Fook me that’s some weaponry..

Don’t forget - we even had the Welsh Xavi.. :D

[Balinkay]

Come on Steveo, we've had this debate before - Hendo was no loess instrumental in that team than Coutinho and at worst marginally less so than Sterling.

Of course it's easier to thrive in a good team, but let's not take away what's due.

[Steveo]

Not really debating Coutinho vs Henderson mate - just suggesting Coutinho was part of a formidable attack even though he started that season with just 13 premier league games after switching in January of that year from Inter Milan.

No doubt playing with both Suarez and Sturridge in deadly form in attack - helped him a ton too.

Stevie Gerrard was also superb at DM to be fair.

[Steveo]

Flanagan also had a storming season but nobody mentions him now do they..? D

[Insidious]

Flanagan also had a storming season but nobody mentions him now do they..? D

His celebration against Spurs could be an ad against Erectile Dysfunction at least.

[Steveo]

Is that the one where he slides towards the camera with his legs apart?

[Insidious]

Is that the one where he slides towards the camera with his legs apart?

Yep.

One of the uploads on YouTube is from a username called "Flanagan'sboner"

[Steveo]

I guess he took Rodgers a little too literally when he said - just go out there and "enjoy" yourself..:highly_amused:

[southernboy]

I recall being absolutely gutted when Henderson got the late red card against city in 2014. It meant he missed 3 of the last 4 games that season. It was a massive blow. He had a huge influence that season.

[Steveo]

He was superb mate - but so were many players including this little chap. Imagine if he was an England international..



https://youtu.be/g5sUfY-5-2U

[redebreck]

I recall being absolutely gutted when Henderson got the late red card against city in 2014. It meant he missed 3 of the last 4 games that season. It was a massive blow. He had a huge influence that season.

Forget Gerrard's slip, Henderson's red card probably cost us the title that season.

[Insidious]

Not many Captains have won Club World Cup, Champion's League and European Super Cup in the same calendar year.

Fernando Hierro (Real Madrid)
Carles Puyol (Barcelona)
Philipp Lahm (Bayern Munich)
Andres Iniesta (Barcelona)
Iker Casillas (Real Madrid)
Sergio Ramos (Real Madrid)
Jordan Henderson (Liverpool)

Gerrard was injured for the 2005 Super Cup, wasn't he? So Jordan has Captained the side to as many Cups as Gerrard did? Open to correction.

[skyebo]

Forget Gerrard's slip, Henderson's red card probably cost us the title that season.

We played the same way with Henderson in the team as we did without him, so I doubt his absence cost us the title.

[Nineteenx]

I love Hendo as much as the next guy (I did start the thread) but captaincy in general is load of bollocks. VVD, Milner, Robbo or even Trent would make decent captains. As good as Hendo is stamina/endurance aside there isn't any part of his game as good as Gerrard's.

Overall team play as opposed to individuality, selflessness and defending are all parts of Henderson's game that are vastly superior

[eggy81]

Most of the players in this side are vastly superior to the houllier team and all the teams gerrard played in. We would have won feck all since 95 without stevie. The older teams would have won feck all with Henderson in them rather than stevie though imo. Henderson is perfect fit for this side and klopps style and is a top class midfielder. Not a match winner though which is what we needed stevie to be at the time.

[southernboy]

Forget Gerrard's slip, Henderson's red card probably cost us the title that season.


We played the same way with Henderson in the team as we did without him, so I doubt his absence cost us the title.

In my honest opinion we were better when Henderson played because he gave Gerrard the freedom to get forward and supply the forwards. Who replaced the suspended Henderson? I genuinely can’t remember.

[Insidious]

In my honest opinion we were better when Henderson played because he gave Gerrard the freedom to get forward and supply the forwards. Who replaced the suspended Henderson? I genuinely can’t remember.

I'm trying to think back - Sturbridge I think may not have played against Norwich and our squad options were limited then - I seem to remember us using Moses in the later stages of that season, so maybe Moses/Sterling/Suarez up front.

Gerrard and Coutinho surely would have played behind that.....so......Allen?

[southernboy]

Well, if it was Allen, we definitely didn’t play the same with or without Henderson. Losing him for those 3 games was definitely a blow. Rodgers has mentioned it many times.

It’s a shame the forum history doesn’t go back that far. It would be great to go back and read those match threads.

[Steveo]

Rodgers would quite naturally mention it. It was the run in and we dropped 5 points losing stupidly at home ( Chelsea - the ego game I call it ) in a game we didn’t need to win and then trying to catch up goal difference when 3 goals ahead at Palace. What else would Rodgers say. It was ultimately bad luck - Gerrard’s slip and naive management that cost us BUT Henderson played in 5 of our 6 losses and 5 of our 6 draws. So did Phil Coutinho BTW.

[Insidious]

It's going to sound like an odd thing to say, but my sense of regret about 13/14 isn't all that large.

In terms of the "Butterfly Effect" we may not be where we are now if that season goes differently - poised for Dynasty-building with Klopp and a team that's incredibly likeable.

It's funny how stuff works out - Blackburn were going to sign Lewandowski but his flight was delayed due to the Iceland ash cloud, so he ended up signing for Dortmund. Dortmund.may not have been QUITE as good as they became and Klopp may never have become our manager.

Blackburn, as it happens, apparently could have signed Zidane but went for Tim Sherwood. Odd thing, this Football lark.

Can we beat Leicester please? Followed by racking up points in January and February during the horrible run City have?

[Steveo]

It's going to sound like an odd thing to say, but my sense of regret about 13/14 isn't all that large.

In terms of the "Butterfly Effect" we may not be where we are now if that season goes differently - poised for Dynasty-building with Klopp and a team that's incredibly likeable.

It's funny how stuff works out - Blackburn were going to sign Lewandowski but his flight was delayed due to the Iceland ash cloud, so he ended up signing for Dortmund. Dortmund.may not have been QUITE as good as they became and Klopp may never have become our manager.

Blackburn, as it happens, apparently could have signed Zidane but went for Tim Sherwood. Odd thing, this Football lark.

Can we beat Leicester please? Followed by racking up points in January and February during the horrible run City have?



Yep Sid - I have been thinking the same. We win that title and we don’t get Klopp..

[ianlfc]

What a performance from him tonight, Bloody brilliant.

[Nineteenx]

He is outshining Fabinho playing back in the position he replace him in, he's been absolutely brilliant this season and the last 5 or 6 games in particular

[miller0863]

He’s been Captain fantastic and if he lifts the League title this season I hope he will finally shake off all the doubters once and for all. All action, driving the team forward, spraying the passes around long and short, making a decent number of chances for those in front of him game after game. Talk about growing into the shirt.

[justincredible]

Jordan Gerrardson, lol.... Truly a captain fantastic.

[Steveo]

He is outshining Fabinho playing back in the position he replace him in, he's been absolutely brilliant this season and the last 5 or 6 games in particular

This was the point I was trying to make. He isn’t just far better in a more advanced midfield role - but simply looks a different player altogether IMO. As though something has clicked and he now does what he always wanted to but thought twice about doing. What we used to see in moments and brief glimpses has become his standard game.

Playing that instinctive ball - the one that comes with risk BUT that also can open up a path to goal or cut a team wide open. He is looking for that ball ALL game now and not just in AM - but DM even @ CB.!!! Making runs - not just dummy runs - but WANTING the ball in tight areas because he has belief...!

He has become absolutely vital - far more so IMO than ever before. Let’s hope to god that nasty stamp doesn’t keep him out.

[Aldo1988]

Horrenderson.

[vin]

Still runs funny though :rolleyes:

[Aldo1988]

Still runs funny though :rolleyes:

Only whiskey drinking alcoholics think that 😂😂

[Nineteenx]

This was the point I was trying to make. He isn’t just far better in a more advanced midfield role - but simply looks a different player altogether IMO. As though something has clicked and he now does what he always wanted to but thought twice about doing. What we used to see in moments and brief glimpses has become his standard game.

Playing that instinctive ball - the one that comes with risk BUT that also can open up a path to goal or cut a team wide open. He is looking for that ball ALL game now and not just in AM - but DM even @ CB.!!! Making runs - not just dummy runs - but WANTING the ball in tight areas because he has belief...!

He has become absolutely vital - far more so IMO than ever before. Let’s hope to god that nasty stamp doesn’t keep him out.

'It's only pain' as someone famously once said ;)

[dicko1969]

In my honest opinion we were better when Henderson played because he gave Gerrard the freedom to get forward and supply the forwards. Who replaced the suspended Henderson? I genuinely can’t remember.
Where would gerrard play?
Would we win the league.
A good squad player to come on last 15.

[southernboy]

Where would gerrard play?
Would we win the league.
A good squad player to come on last 15.

I’m talking about then, not now ;)

[Nineteenx]

Another awe inspiring MOTM display from Captain fantastic again in yesterday's win, simply everywhere, exactly where he needed to be when he was needed, Fabinho's got his work cut out to win his starting spot back, Hendo's absolutely eclipsed him with his displays after moving back into the position during his absence, miles better defensively AND offensively

[Nineteenx]

MOTM for the second game running, top top quality AGAIN

[Kev0909]

Thought most players stopped improving at a certain age, Henderson and Milner.. well I don't even have to say anything do I.

[HLOGI]

MOTM for the second game running, top top quality AGAIN

He has truly become his own man. He is nobodies shadow and history will remember him as one of the greats. I see people are even mentioning him for POTY my gosh he has not silenced the critic he has blown them out of the water.

[skyebo]

Thought most players stopped improving at a certain age, Henderson and Milner.. well I don't even have to say anything do I.

Milner has been consistent throughout his career. It's no coincidence that Henderson has upped his game since we signed Keita. If Keita would have carried on the form that prompted the club to sign him, it would probably have been Henderson that was making way, it will be interesting to see who gets the midfield roles when they are all fit. There's nothing wrong with the midfield apart from a lack of goals. Henderson's contribution of goals in almost 9 years is abysmal.

[Kev0909]

Milner has been consistent throughout his career. It's no coincidence that Henderson has upped his game since we signed Keita. If Keita would have carried on the form that prompted the club to sign him, it would probably have been Henderson that was making way, it will be interesting to see who gets the midfield roles when they are all fit. There's nothing wrong with the midfield apart from a lack of goals. Henderson's contribution of goals in almost 9 years is abysmal.

True milner has but he's aged very well.

[vin]

He has truly become his own man. He is nobodies shadow and history will remember him as one of the greats. I see people are even mentioning him for POTY my gosh he has not silenced the critic he has blown them out of the water.

In 2012 we offered him as part of the swap deal for Clint Dempsey!

[Nineteenx]

He has truly become his own man. He is nobodies shadow and history will remember him as one of the greats. I see people are even mentioning him for POTY my gosh he has not silenced the critic he has blown them out of the water.

He'll still be looking to improve week in week out

[dicko1969]

Henderson, Milner and Winjaldum deserve masses of credit.

The unsung heroes... bollox.

They are brilliant players. A midfield that can tackle, pass, run all day long. Defend and attack.

World class.

[CCTV]

Milner has been consistent throughout his career. It's no coincidence that Henderson has upped his game since we signed Keita. If Keita would have carried on the form that prompted the club to sign him, it would probably have been Henderson that was making way, it will be interesting to see who gets the midfield roles when they are all fit. There's nothing wrong with the midfield apart from a lack of goals. Henderson's contribution of goals in almost 9 years is abysmal.

Ageee with that, Keita & Fabinho pushed Hendo & Gini to new heights

[Nineteenx]

Ageee with that, Keita & Fabinho pushed Hendo & Gini to new heights

All part of having a great squad and getting the right players with the right mentality, all with very strong core abilities and attributes but also with different abilities and working in a great environment in which the players all continually work hard to improve and learn from each other and are constantly striving to be the very best players and people they can be.

I loved Hendo's & Trent's post match comments, just shows what the group is like, how driven they are, how humble they are in the knowledge there is ALWAYS room for improvement and how much they respect that is achieved through practice and hard work. SO focused on improving all the time and winning each next game, we're so very lucky to have such an incredible group of players, all of them absolutely brilliant lads and it's a pure joy to watch them continue to develop and savour just how much they love playing the game and appreciate each others hard work and contributions throughout the whole squad

[Nineteenx]

What's Hendo's song by the way? After the immense personal and team play development he's achieved in the last year and continues striving for even more of I really think it should be simply "Hendo, Hendo Hendo, Hendo Hendo, Hendo there's no limit" to the tune of 'There's no limit'

GDD_gIhjh30

[Nineteenx]

He's right too

https://www.goal.com/en/news/flamengo-boss-jesus-names-liverpools-henderson-as-the-best/1u61s5ae3qpb91dlwml8mbppds

[Nineteenx]

What a legend

VhNeNM-3OQ8

[Nineteenx]

let's have some more of this, wasn't the second goal in this v Chelsea goal of the season?

91L3odKQJrc

[Nineteenx]

Not Hendo's best game of this season today, but played a crucial part in the goal and Mourinho put on a clever press that caught a few of the lads out a few times and had his team block the lines really well for most of the game

[Frasier]

The midfield Dirk Kuyt.

[LFC vs PFC]

There was a number of times where TAA bombed down the right and cut it back to Hendo, but he took an extra touch before putting it into the box, and by that point the chance had gone.
I'm wondering if it was because he was playing DM?

[Balinkay]

There was a number of times where TAA bombed down the right and cut it back to Hendo, but he took an extra touch before putting it into the box, and by that point the chance had gone.
I'm wondering if it was because he was playing DM?

Earlier in the CP v Arsenal game there were so many absurdly overhit crosses. I'm not sure it can be just down to the lack of quality. It might have been extremely windy in London yesterday - maybe that influenced some of the decision making? TAA and Robbo both had some horrible crosses you normally don't see from them.

[Nineteenx]

There was a number of times where TAA bombed down the right and cut it back to Hendo, but he took an extra touch before putting it into the box, and by that point the chance had gone.
I'm wondering if it was because he was playing DM?

I think it was windy in London yesterday saw that in the Palace/Arsenal game. Several players made uncharacteristic errors, it wasn't just Hendo, or him anymore than some other players, Tottenham's tactics had a bit to do with it too, they were letting our lads knock it around the back, then as the third or fourth pass went to our player they quickly moved to close all their options with 2 players bearing down on them too having previously not pressed those players, and set of double pressers on individual players a few times, so when they classily sidestepped one there was suddenly another player immediately on top of them. It was typical Mourinho, letting the better side have possession and trying to force an error, it was quite clever tactics, Wolves tried something similar in our recent game v them also, catches players out if you do it sporadically, so it's something they all have to learn from.

Robbo drives me mad for what you mentioned sometimes, he does it far too often for me, he gets the ball when he's got a little time (not loads) and space to take a quick touch and put the ball into the box early from a little deeper, whipping it over the first defender or through the channel, so it goes behind the other defenders and is bouncing and difficult to deal with, and he always takes another touch then passes it back or inside and we've quite often got Mane and Mo on the oppositions defensive line when he does it. I don't want him doing it all the time, but there are 3 or 4 times in a game when it's well on for him, and he doesn't try it

[Steveo]

So well deserved... Can't ask for more

https://www.liverpoolfc.com/news/first-team/382718-jordan-henderson-named-england-men-s-player-of-the-year

[Nineteenx]

So well deserved... Can't ask for more

https://www.liverpoolfc.com/news/first-team/382718-jordan-henderson-named-england-men-s-player-of-the-year

Completely agree, it's an absolute travesty that he isn't England captain, well, he is really, just not officially, always seems like the leader out there whenever he plays

[redebreck]

Completely agree, it's an absolute travesty that he isn't England captain, well, he is really, just not officially, always seems like the leader out there whenever he plays

Sir Harry Tosser is out until April/May. If Engurland have any games before then, Jordan should be captain.
Unless of course, whiter than white Sterling is given any token armbands.

[skyebo]

Sir Harry Tosser is out until April/May. If Engurland have any games before then, Jordan should be captain.
Unless of course, whiter than white Sterling is given any token armbands.

There's a few ahead of Sterling regarding the captaincy. In any case, Henderson is the named vice captain so no reason why anyone else would get it in Kane's absence.

[vin]

Completely agree, it's an absolute travesty that he isn't England captain, well, he is really, just not officially, always seems like the leader out there whenever he plays

Travesty?

[Nineteenx]

Absolutely fucking superb again today, just shaded for MOTM by Big Virgil and desperately unlucky not to score with De Gea making a brilliant save to tip his effort onto the post

[skyebo]

Absolutely fucking superb again today, just shaded for MOTM by Big Virgil and desperately unlucky not to score with De Gea making a brilliant save to tip his effort onto the post

Yes he was, and I thought he was the right choice to get MOTM.

[CCTV]

Yes he was, and I thought he was the right choice to get MOTM.

Did he get it ? Thought the midfield 3 were just behind Virgil today but still no contest for motm.
Gomez did pretty well, but with all 4 virgil covered them admirably.

[skyebo]

Did he get it ? Thought the midfield 3 were just behind Virgil today but still no contest for motm.
Gomez did pretty well, but with all 4 virgil covered them admirably.

Yes CCTV, Geoff Shreeves asked Salah to give him his award after interviewing them both.

[CCTV]

Cool Skyebo, bit surprised

[Nineteenx]

Really pleased the pundits gave Hendo MOTM, it was neck and neck between him and Virgil for me, I gave it Virgil because he was imperious as ever, got the vital first goal and I think he gets overlooked because he is so damned good, it's just expected ;)

[Nineteenx]

Hendo, absolute legend

https://www.liverpoolfc.com/news/first-team/383434-mohamed-salah-henderson-reaction-liverpool-manchester-united

Henderson, though, was adamant the players cannot allow the situation to influence the way they approach the remainder of the campaign.

“We’re not really thinking about the end. Why should we change now? Why think about the end of the season?” the captain, named Man of the Match, said.

“There are still a lot of games left; we have taken it each game [at a time] for a long time now and it has put us in good stead. So there is no need to change.

“The crowd were unbelievable again today. For us as players, it’s the next game, the next challenge – the Premier League is tough, there are some tough teams. United played well at times today but, overall, I felt we deserved the three points.”

He added: “It is special, we’re enjoying our football but you’ve got to stay hungry, you’ve got to keep learning and keep wanting more. To be fair, this group of players wants to do that.

“Of course, the manager is on us all the time to improve and we know we can certainly improve. It’s about every single day, keep going and keep going until the end of the season.”

[Insidious]

Henderson plus cash for Dempsey.

So glad that didn't happen!

[justincredible]

Henderson plus cash for Dempsey.

So glad that didn't happen!

Shudder....!!

[skyebo]

If Henderson was playing like he is doing now, back then, they wouldn't have considered it. It's only because our owners wouldn't pay the extra for Dempsey that it didn't happen. No-one would have batted an eyelid if Henderson was sold. In all the time he's been here, he has only scored 15 more goals than Van Dijk in 250 more games.

[Nineteenx]

If Henderson was playing like he is doing now, back then, they wouldn't have considered it. It's only because our owners wouldn't pay the extra for Dempsey that it didn't happen. No-one would have batted an eyelid if Henderson was sold. In all the time he's been here, he has only scored 15 more goals than Van Dijk in 250 more games.

I would have, he was always under rated, once he settled he got 6 goals 2012-2013, 5 goals 2013-2014 and 7 goals 2014-2015 and numerous assists in each of those seasons, 12 being his best I believe, better returns than Alonso or Mascherano and decent returns for a box to box midfielder who is doing a lot of winning the ball and defending too and who isn't taking penalties or set pieces, as ever, it wasn't good enough or was under rated by too many people because he wasn't Gerrard. Coutinho's best was only 13 goals and he was playing like a forward for most of that and taking free kicks, Gerrard got 10, 14 and 13 in those seasons, but was taking pens and free kicks and again playing a more attacking role.

The goalscoring midfielder thing is a myth, most of them don't score many goals at all, in any team, the ones who get high numbers of goals and assists are most commonly operating more as a forward and taking penalties and set pieces while other midfielders in their team are doing a lot more of the tackling, defending and closing down to support them having the freedom to do that. Just as our current midfielders support our full backs to play a lot higher up and make the amazing contributions they do.

That being said, I believe there's a lot more to come from Robbo and Trent, it's more difficult for Trent to get goals or slot through balls through the channel because how we play closes the channel between LB and LCB most of the time, Robbo however regularly finds himself in positions to put balls through the channel or drive through the channel or be found in the channel and score, as he should have in our recent game v Spurs and have at least had the crack in a fair few others, so as I say often in the Trent and Robbo thread, I think he needs to work on producing more from these situations, as how we set up supports him being in a forwards or attacking midfielders position frequently in games, far more frequently than our set up allows our midfielders to get in those positions, we/he have to take advantage of that and make more of those situations at times.

That then goes back to the finishing from distance thread, although Robbo's situations are often from 10-12 yards out, the pass to find a team mate from those positions in the channel is quite often blocked, so half the time his best option is to take the shot on, going across the keeper hard and low on the deck to the far corner making sure he hits the target and whacking it so if the keeper saves it's parried out for one of the forwards the pass to was blocked to poke home, or just smash it high into the top corner near post ;) I think there's a lot more to come

[Nineteenx]

Lol hilarious video of Hendo

cHd-0jtTMLI

[Steveo]

Brilliant - Just wish De Gea hadn't tipped that super strike by Jordan on Sunday onto the post ( what a save BTW ) - then Hendo could have done the underpants reveal ( with the word BUMMED in red ) and walk away...

Now that would be something... :D

[teesred]

The Madrid 19 banner is the business. Fully deserves his place on the Kop.

[Nineteenx]

The Madrid 19 banner is the business. Fully deserves his place on the Kop.

I saw that, I was made up for Hendo, thoroughly deserved

[dicko1969]

Henderson

4 trophies in less than 12 months

European Cup
Super cup
World Club
Premier league

Hands up who didnt believe in captain Henderson...

[Balinkay]

He's not won the PL just yet.

[Steveo]

Henderson

4 trophies in less than 12 months

European Cup
Super cup
World Club
Premier league

Hands up who didnt believe in captain Henderson...

I totally didn’t.

[Nineteenx]

I've always believed in Hendo, he's an incredible player, you have to recognise players in their own right and on their own merits based on where and how they play, Shankly would have had Hendo in any of his teams, all our lads fit the following of his conditions, but none moreso than our captain fantastic

“No football club is ever successful without hard work. If everyone thinks along these lines and does the small jobs to the best of their ability, then the world will be better.”

Shankly was the manager that installed the now-iconic ‘This is Anfield’ plaque at the Liverpool grounds during his tenure. The below sentence is one of those Bill Shankly quotes that perfectly sums up why Shankly strove for success at Anfield and who he dedicated it to:

“This is to remind our lads who they’re playing for, and to remind the opposition who they’re playing against.”

“For a player to be good enough to play for Liverpool, he must be prepared to run through a brick wall for me then come out fighting the other side.”

“I’ve drummed it into our players time and again that they are privileged to play for you.”

[miller0863]

I’ve certainly had periods of doubt that he was good enough, in fact there were times when he wasn’t. Rafa was letting him go for the equivalent of lunch money but he refused to go.

He is a great example to all, of what you can do with total dedication, extreme hard work and never say die tenacity.

[Nineteenx]

I’ve certainly had periods of doubt that he was good enough, in fact there were times when he wasn’t. Rafa was letting him go for the equivalent of lunch money but he refused to go.

He is a great example to all, of what you can do with total dedication, extreme hard work and never say die tenacity.

Kenny signed Hendo, he wasn't even here under Rafa, he continually works hard to improve, but he is a far more talented player than people give him credit for, his goal and assist returns prior to being moved to No6 and our change of system were actually really good for a midfielder who was box to box and spent a lot of time doing the hard yards and a lot of defensive work and who didn't take penalties, free kicks or corners. He has a very high level of ability, people seem to think hard work is the only thing he offers

Let's take a look at a youtube of Fabinho being 'great' that perfectly illustrates a point I made earlier in this thread and why Hendo being at 6 has coincided with our run of clean sheets, knowledge, reading of the game, better positional sense and awareness. This Fabinho being great youtube is absolutely riddled with examples of Fabinho not having the same level of these qualities as Hendo, letting a player get played in behind him centrally, running at our defence with options and having to chase back to try and make a tackle and these are the examples of when he made the tackle, but there were plenty of times he didn't. I really rate Fabinho but don't think he's as good as Hendo and think he has a lot of developing to do in the No6 role

How often in any of our games since Hendo went back to No6 have you seen him having to chase back because he's allowed a player to beat our press which he plays a huge part in orchestrating? Once a game in the odd game at that? How often have you seen players get in those positions running at Hendo in our latest run of games? Most of the time they don't even get turned, he's on it, destroying everything, reading the game, playing off his team mates, snuffing out danger right across the pitch before it even gets to the point you see it at in most of Fabinho's being 'great' youtube, his distribution has also been better and understanding of when to press high, like for our goal v Spurs recently, he's not just been destroying everything, he's been making the play brilliantly and making vital contributions further forward

JV8ZDaFjkTo

[miller0863]

Yep my bad, should have said Brendan.

The point stands, he has not always been the player he has become, one of THE first names on the team sheet.

[Nineteenx]

Yep my bad, should have said Brendan.

The point stands, he has not always been the player he has become, one of THE first names on the team sheet.

I'm not knocking Fabinho in any way shape or form, that's what building a squad of top players with different attributes to all push each other, work really fucking hard to evolve and improve their individual games and the teams play is all about, players come in and perform better or change a dynamic helping the team perform better, then the other players watch, learn, work hard and develop and raise the bar again. I think Fabinho is a top top player, I still think when he plays we need Hendo in the line up with him as he doesn't orchestrate the press as well ,read it as well or make the play as well as Hendo does all those things and needs the support of Hendo and I'm sure Fabinho will have been watching Hendo's immense displays and he'll be made to watch videos of them and comparisons to his own game and he'll be pushing hard to raise the bar again.

It's a testament to all our players hard work and the evolution of the team also, better pressing from the team collectively, each player getting better at taking positions off each other in pressing and counter pressing, better movement and use of the pockets for Hendo to have options to make the play as he has been doing, when that wasn't anywhere near the level it is now when he was last at No6 last season, and he'd so often look up and not have an option and be forced to play sideways or backwards.

In some games, particularly those when the opposition are a top top side and have a top top class attacking threat on their left, and midfielders who like to try and sit and dictate play the combination of Hendo and Fabinho is essential, Hendo makes sure he's helping out on our right and covering that space in behind Fabinho while Fabinho's working further forward with Bobby absolutely destroying the CM's of the opposition.

I think Hendo at No6 helps all our other midfielders play better, it's going to be interesting when Fabinho comes back in, because it's a different dynamic and will be a different way of playing, the way I see it at present is the Hendo covers Gini and particularly our RCM to be more attacking and Gini or the RCM covers Hendo when he picks the right moment to press high anywhere across the line, when Fabinho plays, he plays a lot more central, it's very rare you see him helping out at either full back position in any game and he plays further forward, so Gini and Hendo are a bit more restricted to their fixed positions and aware they have to cover the hole Fabinho pressing so high leaves, so the midfield and our play is less fluid. That dynamic changes again when Matip plays, because he reads the game brilliantly and will often be looking to move into the space Fabinho leaves to tackle on opposition mid

[Nineteenx]

When Fabinho does come back in, Hendo has to show he's raised the bar again when he plays No8 at RCM as he didn't play that role in an attacking sense as well yet this season as he did when he was introduced there last season, he also has to show he's recognised the hole Fabinho's high destroyer press leaves and is on top of it taking his usual excellent positions off our other players to make sure it's covered and he and Gini working together to make sure it is while remaining in an excellent position to get across and help out or cover Trent AND Gomez or Matip being aware of it to and ready to step into midfield and make a tackle or a foul to halt any opposition player found in the hole as and when is necessary.

Liverpool are a machine, we need to maintain incredible awareness of the slight changes of dynamic and positioning of the cogs certain changes will make

[Nineteenx]

I would like to see Fabinho study Hendo's performances and use them to improve, because the rotation of positions of our midfield it has created has made us far more fluid and a lot harder to defend again, it's been actual real total football, not in the false pretentious Van Gaal sense, but actual total football, there are loads of example and subtleties and layers to what I'm talking about, Van Gaal's wasn't total football, it was just players assuming each other roles if/when they found themselves in another players position and being comfortable in that position and delivering in it, we've evolved our play so we're doing a lot of that and not for the sake of it or to be smart or pretentious, but as natural evolution and progression, but what we do is a lot more evolved than Van Gaal's version, the entire team defending, pressing and counter pressing especially, with the counter pressing positioning becoming more advanced so the players are not only in a great defensive and counter pressing position as they're not involved in a move, but they're also in a position to support the ball and become actively involved in the move.

An example of Fabinho having to be more fluid when he comes back in and play his part in the team being more fluid can be demonstrated by Wijnaldum's just offside goal in Sunday's game, he (LCM) was doing the high press/supporting the ball, Hendo was in a DM/inside RCM position and it was Ox (RCM) who played the through ball for Gini from the LCM No8 position, brilliant stuff, but that wasn't happening with Fabinho in the team, it was a lot more rigid, easier for opposition teams to make plans to deal with each player, it's something that's developed hugely in Fabs absence

Edit: And all of that said is why I bang on about more goals from Robbo, when he gets in the ball in that channel between RB and RCB, becoming a forward, rather than being a full back that's found himself in a forwards position, but he keeps getting in there and I'm sure it will come with time. Similarly, although the LB LCB channel for Trent to attempt through balls, smash a shot through it or make a run through it is often closed, take advantage of any opportunities to open it by driving the ball in field towards it with Mo or Firminho making an inside out run to open it for him, assuming the role of an attacking midfielder, looking to then play a through ball towards the far post for Mane or Bobby, shoot from distance across the keeper, drive through the channel with the ball or play it in to Bobby's feet making the run through the channel looking for the return pass

I think we're just 'warming up' brilliant as we've been so far this season, there is a hell of a lot more to come from this team/squad

[Nineteenx]

A fine display

2lisn-1byHw

[dicko1969]

I totally didn’t.

Only 2 people being honest here

Funny how everyone else is very 🤫🤫🤫

90% of 'fans' didnt believe in him

[CCTV]

Only 2 people being honest here

Funny how everyone else is very 🤫🤫🤫

90% of 'fans' didnt believe in him

I'm not sure how to answer.

In one sense I believed in him as in not replacing him and keeping as a member of the squad.
In another I didnt think he'd be an automatic starter and has done better in the last while since Fabinho and Keita were signed than I thought. Same with Gini recently they are both on an upward spiral from the introduction of stiffer competition imo.

[Nineteenx]

Only 2 people being honest here

Funny how everyone else is very ������

90% of 'fans' didnt believe in him

I'm being perfectly honest, I've always backed Hendo, you could search my posts back to when he first arrived under Kenny until now and you'd find that to be the case, I guarantee it, my only criticism of him very early in his reds career was that he needed to get his head on swivel and constantly scan the pitch a lot more to be more aware of what was on and he made that improvement just a couple of months in

[Nineteenx]

I'm not sure how to answer.

In one sense I believed in him as in not replacing him and keeping as a member of the squad.
In another I didnt think he'd be an automatic starter and has done better in the last while since Fabinho and Keita were signed than I thought. Same with Gini recently they are both on an upward spiral from the introduction of stiffer competition imo.

All our midfielders play better with Hendo in the team, Keita had struggled and suddenly clicked when Hendo cam in at RCM last season and they've all played better since he's been playing at No6 in Fabinho's absence, because, he's the boss

[dicko1969]

Not only that
But he took over from a Liverpool legend

I think we should be now saying Henderson is a legend too

When we look at our previous captains

Yeats , Smith, Hughes, Thompson, Souness, Hansen, Hyypia, Gerrard , Henderson

Henderson now should have that status

I think after Gerrard it is unfair to compare him to Gerrard.

[dicko1969]

I'm being perfectly honest, I've always backed Hendo, you could search my posts back to when he first arrived under Kenny until now and you'd find that to be the case, I guarantee it, my only criticism of him very early in his reds career was that he needed to get his head on swivel and constantly scan the pitch a lot more to be more aware of what was on and he made that improvement just a couple of months in

I know

[Nineteenx]

Not only that
But he took over from a Liverpool legend

I think we should be now saying Henderson is a legend too

When we look at our previous captains

Yeats , Smith, Hughes, Thompson, Souness, Hansen, Hyypia, Gerrard , Henderson

Henderson now should have that status

I think after Gerrard it is unfair to compare him to Gerrard.

Not so much unfair as completely stupid, since the season Rafa moved him to AM off Torres Gerrard has operated as more of an attacking midfielder and had other midfielders around him doing a lot more of the leg work, defending and tackling to support that, they're completely different types of player so comparing them is just plain stupid in the first place

Edit: For instance people were comparing their goals and assists, when Hendo was doing a lot more work in our own half and around the half way line and wasn't as far forward as frequently to have as many opportunities to score and assist, although he did very very well on that front when used as a box to box player 5, 6 and 7 goals in consecutive seasons with 8-12 assists, 12 being his highest and he wasn't taking penalties, free kicks or corners while Gerrard was, for a midfielder playing the role he was Hendo's return of goals and assists was actually very good, plus all his defending, pressing and tackling, he's always been vastly under rated

[CCTV]

All our midfielders play better with Hendo in the team, Keita had struggled and suddenly clicked when Hendo cam in at RCM last season and they've all played better since he's been playing at No6 in Fabinho's absence, because, he's the boss

Hes integral now and people on other lfc outlets are talking about him in terms of pl player of the year and if not a serious contender.

Do you think hes improved since summer 2018 ? Or just playing to the same level and getting the appreciation now?

I think he has come on a lot since summer 2018, getting dropped sort of last year and coming back in at rcm noticeable imo and lifting no6 would be 2 times I think weve seen him go up a level.
One due to competition for places and him fighting for his, the other being anointed with a big trophy and the confidence and hunger that instilled in everyone in ways.

[Nineteenx]

Hes integral now and people on other lfc outlets are talking about him in terms of pl player of the year and if not a serious contender.

Do you think hes improved since summer 2018 ? Or just playing to the same level and getting the appreciation now?

I think he has come on a lot since summer 2018, getting dropped sort of last year and coming back in at rcm noticeable imo and lifting no6 would be 2 times I think weve seen him go up a level.
One due to competition for places and him fighting for his, the other being anointed with a big trophy and the confidence and hunger that instilled in everyone in ways.

I think everyone's improved including Hendo as from page 12


I'm not knocking Fabinho in any way shape or form, that's what building a squad of top players with different attributes to all push each other, work really fucking hard to evolve and improve their individual games and the teams play is all about, players come in and perform better or change a dynamic helping the team perform better, then the other players watch, learn, work hard and develop and raise the bar again. I think Fabinho is a top top player, I still think when he plays we need Hendo in the line up with him as he doesn't orchestrate the press as well ,read it as well or make the play as well as Hendo does all those things and needs the support of Hendo and I'm sure Fabinho will have been watching Hendo's immense displays and he'll be made to watch videos of them and comparisons to his own game and he'll be pushing hard to raise the bar again.

It's a testament to all our players hard work and the evolution of the team also, better pressing from the team collectively, each player getting better at taking positions off each other in pressing and counter pressing, better movement and use of the pockets for Hendo to have options to make the play as he has been doing, when that wasn't anywhere near the level it is now when he was last at No6 last season, and he'd so often look up and not have an option and be forced to play sideways or backwards.

In some games, particularly those when the opposition are a top top side and have a top top class attacking threat on their left, and midfielders who like to try and sit and dictate play the combination of Hendo and Fabinho is essential, Hendo makes sure he's helping out on our right and covering that space in behind Fabinho while Fabinho's working further forward with Bobby absolutely destroying the CM's of the opposition.

I think Hendo at No6 helps all our other midfielders play better, it's going to be interesting when Fabinho comes back in, because it's a different dynamic and will be a different way of playing, the way I see it at present is the Hendo covers Gini and particularly our RCM to be more attacking and Gini or the RCM covers Hendo when he picks the right moment to press high anywhere across the line, when Fabinho plays, he plays a lot more central, it's very rare you see him helping out at either full back position in any game and he plays further forward, so Gini and Hendo are a bit more restricted to their fixed positions and aware they have to cover the hole Fabinho pressing so high leaves, so the midfield and our play is less fluid. That dynamic changes again when Matip plays, because he reads the game brilliantly and will often be looking to move into the space Fabinho leaves to tackle on opposition mid

[redebreck]

Thinking back to when he first arrived here, I was disappointed in him and also critical. Since then however he has improved tremendously and I see him as a complete midfielder. Early in his Liverpool career he seemed a bit lost and I recall him being unaware of what was going on around him. He has, obviously, grown and matured within the squad.

[Nineteenx]

A fine display

2lisn-1byHw

Just look at all the different areas of the pitch Hendo contributes in during a single game, it's both inspiring and incredible, this short highlights youtube of his contributions in just Sunday's game has more top quality in it than the vast majority of midfielders show reels made up of their very best bits over an entire season

[Nineteenx]

And again simply awesome in the WCC final

DN4qTdg-p7w

"Henderson wasn't born, he was quarried"

[Steveo]

Aah Tommy Smith..
Hard as nails he was - and looked it..

Good snippet on Hendo and Klopp’s influence.


https://www.thisisanfield.com/2020/01/how-klopps-man-management-led-to-jordan-hendersons-emergence-exceptional-season/

[Nineteenx]

Aah Tommy Smith..
Hard as nails he was - and looked it..

Good snippet on Hendo and Klopp’s influence.


https://www.thisisanfield.com/2020/01/how-klopps-man-management-led-to-jordan-hendersons-emergence-exceptional-season/

I saw that, a very fine and accurate article, most of this is taken from a Guardian article I believe

[eggy81]

Always said hed become a good player. Even when he was being slated. May have wavered once or twice after very bad performances but I didnt expect him to teach his current level. There were great signs of his ability in the Suarez team.

[Nineteenx]

Another incredible performance from MOTM Captain fantastic Hendo, a goal and an absolute crucial and brilliant assist through the eye of a needle for Bobby

[CCTV]

Another incredible performance from MOTM Captain fantastic Hendo, a goal and an absolute crucial and brilliant assist through the eye of a needle for Bobby

Joetan gave him motm - a special honour :)

[ianlfc]

Another incredible performance from MOTM Captain fantastic Hendo, a goal and an absolute crucial and brilliant assist through the eye of a needle for Bobby

Brilliant again. He's been our player of the year. He never gives up and always wants the ball something kids should look up to.

[dicko1969]

Thinking back to when he first arrived here, I was disappointed in him and also critical. Since then however he has improved tremendously and I see him as a complete midfielder. Early in his Liverpool career he seemed a bit lost and I recall him being unaware of what was going on around him. He has, obviously, grown and matured within the squad.

Very true at the start
Looked very nervous

Still a lot of silenteers not piping up with an "I was wrong" message

He thoroughly deserves credit now

And dont say he doesn't do it for England... because while gives a flying pig about that

[teesred]

Brilliant again. He's been our player of the year. He never gives up and always wants the ball something kids should look up to.

Defo. Id love to see him get club player and writers poty. What a year its been for him the last 12 months for him have been unreal. Still in 3 comps too. Going to get even better and he deserves every bit of praise and recognition hes getting.
Another one for our list of best players in the world playing for LFC. Its never bad being a Liverpool fan but just how fucking good is it right now! Its mint.

[Nineteenx]

Robbo on captain fantastic

https://www.liverpoolfc.com/news/first-team/384108-andy-robertson-lauds-jordan-henderson

Andy Robertson has highlighted the stunning form of Jordan Henderson and believes the captain has been 'driving' Liverpool forward this season.

Henderson once again impressed with a Man of the Match performance in Thursday’s 2-1 victory at Wolverhampton Wanderers.

The midfielder opened the scoring at Molineux early in the first half before delivering the assist for Roberto Firmino’s 84th-minute winner.

“Hendo, for me, this season has been different class,” Robertson told Liverpoolfc.com following the win. “He’s been one of, if not our best player this season.

“Sometimes over the years Hendo’s not got the credit that he deserves. But when you play with him, you train with him and see the way he acts off the field, it’s an absolute pleasure [for him] to be my captain and everyone’s captain.

“For us, he’s now getting the credit that he deserves and that’s what it’s all about for us because he’s getting the recognition that his performances deserve.

“And today just epitomises Jordan Henderson – the way he went about his business, the way he scored the goal and his assist.

“His all-round play the past couple of months has been second to none and he’s really driving us forward to the position we are in now.”

Henderson is leading a Liverpool side that sits 16 points clear at the top of the Premier League, while also possessing a game in hand on second-placed Manchester City.

And Jürgen Klopp’s trophy-hungry squad are leaving it all out on the pitch in fixture after fixture in order to deliver more silverware to Anfield this term.

Pos. P W D L GF GA GD Pts
1 Liverpool 23 22 1 0 54 15 39 67
2 Manchester City 24 16 3 5 65 27 38 51
3 Leicester City 24 15 3 6 52 24 28 48
“We are a team that don’t find excuses, we are a team that gets on with it,” Robertson stressed.

“Are there some games you go in tired? Are there some games you go in with an injury when you are playing with pain? Of course there are. But like I’ve said, we are going for something that’s never been done before.

“We are playing for a club that is a fantastic club to play for. The fans are really enjoying it, we are all enjoying it, so why wouldn’t we put ourselves out there?

“Pain barrier or tiredness, it’s just about breaking through the barriers and it’s about just giving your all for the badge and for your teammates in there – and that’s what all of us are doing just now.

“Then we rest and maybe hobble about for a couple of days and then we go again. It’s a fantastic group of boys in there, an honest group who work so hard for each other and that’s why we are getting the results just now.”

“For a player to be good enough to play for Liverpool, he must be prepared to run through a brick wall for me then come out fighting the other side.”

[Nineteenx]

“Are there some games you go in tired? Are there some games you go in with an injury when you are playing with pain? Of course there are. But like I’ve said, we are going for something that’s never been done before."

This IS interesting, sounds to me like the lads are going for every single trophy available to them, with all their focus on each next game, winning it, getting another vital 3 points or booking their progression to the next round and I would not bet against them achieving that, one game at a time, see where it takes us

[Nineteenx]

A fine display

1CodV1hTyXM

[TheDOC1979]

Over the last few months, he’s actually been Tremendserson!

Well played lad

[Nineteenx]

Captain fantastics touch map v West Ham, incredible

https://www.liverpoolfc.com/news/first-team/384972-west-ham-0-2-liverpool-premier-league-talking-points

[dicko1969]

The new modern xavi - pirlo

[Balinkay]

Pivi or Xirlo?

[Nineteenx]

The new modern xavi - pirlo

He's not either of those, the only similarity is that he is a great and unique player and Captain in his own right and God knows he's worked incredibly hard for that and continues to like all the rest of the lads

[skyebo]

Wijnaldum is quoted as saying he doesn't know if he will be here next season. I hope he is, he doesn't get the credit he deserves a lot of the time for the work he puts in.

[Steveo]

Agreed skyebo - Put the lid back on that magic oil lamp... Don't let the Gini out...!!

[Nineteenx]

Agreed skyebo - Put the lid back on that magic oil lamp... Don't let the Gini out...!!

Yes sign up Gini

[shminkyred]

If Henderson was playing like he is doing now, back then, they wouldn't have considered it. It's only because our owners wouldn't pay the extra for Dempsey that it didn't happen. No-one would have batted an eyelid if Henderson was sold. In all the time he's been here, he has only scored 15 more goals than Van Dijk in 250 more games.

He can play anywhere.....Utility players always seem to be underrated........hes a managers dream because he follows his instructions to a Tee......

People say all of a sudden he can pass.....I seem to remember him dropping balls right onto Suarez's shoulder from midfield.....and I'm convinced in those days we lost more games when he wasn't playing...

Nice to see people coming round to my way of thinking...lol

[Nineteenx]

A goal and assist for Captain fantastic and another fine display, true to form Hendo's all about the team

https://www.liverpoolfc.com/news/first-team/385505-jordan-henderson-southampton-premier-league-reaction

Jordan Henderson was quick to bat away the attention coming his way for his excellent form, insisting Liverpool's cause is far more important.

The captain was on the scoresheet in Saturday's 4-0 victory over Southampton when he calmly finished in front of the Kop to add the Reds' second of the afternoon.

The No.14, who also provided the assist for Mohamed Salah's first goal, was given a standing ovation from Anfield as he was replaced by Adam Lallana for the final few minutes.

However, he was quick to deflect the post-match praise onto his teammates.

"I'm enjoying this season, we've put in some really good performances," Henderson told Liverpoolfc.com. "Everybody is enjoying their football but it's also about the work ethic and giving everything for each other – and that's the most important thing to me.

"Just give everything you can for your teammates, which we have been doing. If you do that then you get your rewards at the end.

"For us, we just need to continue that, give everything we can right until the end of the season and then see where we are.

"It's always nice to get a goal, especially at Anfield of course. But the most important thing was the three points of course.

"The goals are important obviously and we scored some really good goals in the second half.

"Delighted with performance in the end, especially in the second half. Some really good goals and we've got to be delighted with the three points."

Henderson was put in a position to score by a fine cut-back from Roberto Firmino after he evaded the offside trap when Trent Alexander-Arnold punted the ball up the field.

That was the Brazilian's second assist of the day as he wrapped up a hat-trick of them when creating Salah's second to complete the scoring.

"Some of the stuff he does is madness really!” the skipper said of Firmino. “But he's another outstanding player for us and it was another big performance from him.

"Especially in the second half, everyone put in a really good performance. We're just really delighted to get the three points, especially going into the break now."

The win over Ralph Hasenhuttl's side moved Liverpool 22 points clear at the top of the Premier League with 13 fixtures left to play.

Pos. P W D L GF GA GD Pts
1 Liverpool 25 24 1 0 60 15 45 73
2 Manchester City 24 16 3 5 65 27 38 51
3 Leicester City 25 15 4 6 54 26 28 49
Henderson, though, continues to stress the mindset within the dressing room will not change despite such a lead at the summit.

He stated: "Well we're getting closer to our target but I don't see why we need to change – I keep saying it every week but it's the truth.

"We take the next game as it comes, that's the next challenge and the biggest challenge. We're focussing on that 90 minutes and giving everything we can, respect the opposition like we always do and just focus on each game as it comes.

"That's put us in good stead until now, so there's no need to change. We just need to continue on our journey, keep focused, keep learning at the training ground and then when we play on a weekend, give everything we can."

"Henderson wasn't born, he was quarried"

[Aldo1988]

Horrenderson

[miller0863]

Watched the full game live, then full 90 on Sky and now MOTD and Henderson was absolutely incredible

[Steveo]

Interesting read on the captain..

How Jordan Henderson emerged from the shadow of Steven Gerrard to become Liverpool’s new leader

https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/premier-league/liverpool-fc-jordan-henderson-steven-gerrard-jurgen-klopp-standings-a9318056.html

[Insidious]

Wijnaldum is quoted as saying he doesn't know if he will be here next season. I hope he is, he doesn't get the credit he deserves a lot of the time for the work he puts in.

Excellent player. We'll see what happens I guess. It's not impossible that we have identified someone.

[Nineteenx]

Interesting read on the captain..

How Jordan Henderson emerged from the shadow of Steven Gerrard to become Liverpool’s new leader

https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/premier-league/liverpool-fc-jordan-henderson-steven-gerrard-jurgen-klopp-standings-a9318056.html

Hendo is an absolutely incredible captain and an incredible player and person

[dicko1969]

Horrenderson

What's his maams name?

[dicko1969]

Hendo is an absolutely incredible captain and an incredible player and person

Could have been so different.
He could be fighting for the championship play offs right now.

[Nineteenx]

Awesome, he'd get a fuck sight more assists if our forwards were more clinical too when you see this latest compilation

pfuEigFP-uE

[dicko1969]

He really has grown as a player

2011 when he came ; he looked nervous, scared of making mistakes, he was hiding in a game.

Fast forward to 2014 his red card cost us the league , and the Welsh xavi stepped forward.

2019 he had a year of footballing dreams; 3 trophies.

Soon in 2020 he will most probably get his hands on the premier league trophy.

Well deserved, hard working, dedicated to his profession.

[dicko1969]

Ps In the video 2mins02 wtf was Salah doing

[Nineteenx]

Ps In the video 2mins02 wtf was Salah doing

There's a few of Mo and Mane in there where you think, bloody hell Hendo should have 10-15 assists this season too

[redebreck]

"(2013-14) he would have been an ever-present if he had not picked up a ban for violent contact after poleaxing Samir Nasri in the 3-2 win over Man City.
The suspension meant Henderson missed three of the last four games in the battle for the Premier League trophy.
There is a compelling argument that Gerrard's slip against Chelsea was not the determining moment in the 2013-2104 title race.
The real reason Liverpool's lead at the top ebbed away was Henderson's absence at such a vital moment."

[justincredible]

"(2013-14) he would have been an ever-present if he had not picked up a ban for violent contact after poleaxing Samir Nasri in the 3-2 win over Man City.
The suspension meant Henderson missed three of the last four games in the battle for the Premier League trophy.
There is a compelling argument that Gerrard's slip against Chelsea was not the determining moment in the 2013-2104 title race.
The real reason Liverpool's lead at the top ebbed away was Henderson's absence at such a vital moment."

Well then, the blame lies with Victor Moses. Under no pressure, it was his underhit shit pass to Hendo that forced him to lunge at the ball and thus so, took out Nasri. Hendo was forced into the error.

[Nineteenx]

"(2013-14) he would have been an ever-present if he had not picked up a ban for violent contact after poleaxing Samir Nasri in the 3-2 win over Man City.
The suspension meant Henderson missed three of the last four games in the battle for the Premier League trophy.
There is a compelling argument that Gerrard's slip against Chelsea was not the determining moment in the 2013-2104 title race.
The real reason Liverpool's lead at the top ebbed away was Henderson's absence at such a vital moment."

Hendo was sensational in that side and as ever massively underrated by far too many of our own fans, he was a huge miss, but that side had far too many weak links, including the manager's massive ego and need to appear clever and attempting to vindicate himself as faultless by insisting on fielding his own failed signings

Anyway, no point going back to that and re-opening old wounds, that's long long gone, always be looking forward ;)

[Nineteenx]

Fantastic and incredibly revealing OPTA analysis from this season AND revealing Hendo has been vastly under appreciated by far too many of our fans throughout his entire Liverpool career. Also some incredible stats for Big Bear Allisson, Robbo, Gomez and Mo

With 13 games still to play, Henderson has already accrued seven goals and assists, his highest combined tally since chalking up 15 in the 2014-15 season.

Nor is his positive influence a new phenomenon; data shows that Liverpool have won 60.1 per cent of the Premier League matches where Henderson has featured since his arrival in 2011, and only 43.9 per cent without.

https://www.liverpoolfc.com/news/first-team/386106-opta-stats-liverpool-jordan-henderson-alisson-becker-saves

Sometimes the most niche statistics can be the most revealing.

The list of Premier League players who have won the ball back most in the final third this season, for example, is one you’d expect to be made up of strikers and wingers. And for the most part, it is.

But in joint-second place, with 22 possession regains, is a central midfielder – Liverpool captain Jordan Henderson. And in joint-fifth place, with 19 regains, we find a full-back, with Andy Robertson proving the iconic 70-yard press against Manchester City that so endeared him to Kopites two years ago was no one-off.

The who, what, when, where and why of Liverpool’s 24 wins in 25 Premier League fixtures might be obvious, but what Reid’s research elucidates is the how, and one man that pops up even more in the data than he does in opposition final thirds is Henderson.

Fans who belted out their skipper’s name after his goal and assist in last Saturday’s 4-0 win over Southampton at Anfield are well aware that he’s playing well. But the statistics reinforce the sheer scale of the 29-year-old’s influence.

With 13 games still to play, Henderson has already accrued seven goals and assists, his highest combined tally since chalking up 15 in the 2014-15 season.

Nor is his positive influence a new phenomenon; data shows that Liverpool have won 60.1 per cent of the Premier League matches where Henderson has featured since his arrival in 2011, and only 43.9 per cent without.

Henderson’s win percentage not only stands up well when compared to previous incumbents of the captaincy such as Steven Gerrard [51 per cent] and Sami Hyypia [54 per cent], but it’s in fact the best of any player to ever make more than 200 appearances for Liverpool in the Premier League era.

Henderson is far from the only member of Jürgen Klopp’s squad performing with an outstanding level of consistency, though.

Alisson Becker has saved 26 of the last 27 shots he’s faced, been involved in the build-up to five goals and is averaging 244 minutes per goal conceded this season – the best of any goalkeeper in Premier League history.

The Brazil international even excels when subjected to the rigours of Stats Perform’s new Goalkeeper Index, which simulates how each goalkeeper would perform if they faced all of the 2,108 shots faced by goalkeepers in the top flight so far this season.

Liverpool’s No.1 comes out on top with 0.42 simulated goals conceded per game and 0.74 simulated goals prevented.

Meanwhile, Joe Gomez’s average minutes per goal conceded over a period dating back to the start of the 2018-19 season is a remarkable 345 – 170 minutes more than the nearest contender.

And Mohamed Salah remains top of the charts for opening goals and winning goals stretching back to his 2017 arrival at Anfield.

The Egyptian’s tally of 92 goals and assists during that time puts him 17 clear of Manchester City’s Sergio Aguero in second place.

Mohamed Salah wins Liverpool Goal of the Month for January
Collective effort remains paramount, however, and the research demonstrates that good, old-fashioned hard work remains at the core of everything Klopp’s Liverpool do, with more pressed sequences and shots from fast breaks than any of the 19 Premier League rivals they have already defeated this campaign.

The Reds are also a close second to City in terms of how much width per sequence their opponents are denied, illustrating just how hard it is for teams to keep the ball and manoeuvre it into dangerous areas when up against the world champions.

[Nineteenx]

Superb again today and another vital assist

[teesred]

Superb again today and another vital assist

Indeed. If he doesn't win PotY it's a total fix.

[Insidious]

Superb again today and another vital assist

I want a gif of that pass he made in the 46th or 47th minute - was utterly ludicrous.

EDIT - this will do for now - https://streamable.com/q1e5e?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf

[Nineteenx]

I want a gif of that pass he made in the 46th or 47th minute - was utterly ludicrous.

EDIT - this will do for now - https://streamable.com/q1e5e?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf

Any other player in world football plays that pass and the pundits are creaming their pants over it for weeks, Hendo's absolutely incredible, I've always backed him and rated him, but the levels he's pushing himself to are fantastic, he's doing incredible things everytime he plays for us. I rated him as like having 2 players in one position, Mascherano and Alonso combined, but that pass right there is better than the best I saw from Alonso and he's been playing wordlies like that since he was moved back to No6

[Nineteenx]

I want a gif of that pass he made in the 46th or 47th minute - was utterly ludicrous.

EDIT - this will do for now - https://streamable.com/q1e5e?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf

Everyone needs to watch this, it has to be the ball of the century, a simply incredible pass, absolutely next level world class ball. Fabinho seriously has to up his game, it does suit us and is necessary in some games to play Gini Fabinho Hendo, but in the games we don't need to do that and only start one of them, Hendo surely HAS to be the pick at No6, his pressing, counter pressing, positions he takes off other players, the ground he covers, his vision and awareness are all superior, but his passing and distribution is absolutely miles better.

It really is like having a better version of Alonso and a better version of Mascherano rolled into one player, Hendo is absolutely incredible, I've always backed him, but even I did not expect him to push himself to the levels I've seen in the last 2 months and now he has, well, let's see how much further he can push himself. That's another aspect of watching this team I love, the players are always working so hard to learn, develop and improve and pushing themselves and each other, the evolution element is just out of this world

[Nineteenx]

Looking through highlights reels of this season, but for players missing opportunities they'd usually bury and should bury, Hendo would be right up there fighting with Trent and Robbo for the most assists, I saw at least 10 where he played Mane or Mo in and they'd score from that position 9 times out of 10

[TheDOC1979]

Massive blow having Henderson out. Hope it’s not too long

[jozza800]

Thought Klopp got it wrong last night bringing Fabinho in. Hendo at 6 with the Ox or Keita pushing on would have made more sense.

I understand why he did it though.

[Nineteenx]

Thought Klopp got it wrong last night bringing Fabinho in. Hendo at 6 with the Ox or Keita pushing on would have made more sense.

I understand why he did it though.

I agree to an extent, I see completely why he played that midfield as it has served us so well in so many huge games, but for me it is really a midfield for when we play a side who is very good with the ball and at keeping the ball who is going to keep trying to attack us and I think it would have been absolutely fine and would have worked had they not got their flukey early goal. It's rare Jurgen has an off night, it happens to the very best of them on occasion, after their early goal and the first half I really thought the very first sub should have been Keita for Fabinho with Hendo moving to No6. Let's hope Hendo isn't out for too long and is back for the second leg, we need to look after him as he's our most influential midfielder

[Nineteenx]

Just absolutely immense, we missed Captain fantastic Hendo's phenomenal distribution and covering the entire back four across the entire width of the pitch massively last night, I hope his tweak is only minor and he's back for the second leg

3kJ7-cT9qUg

[toneata]

Out for around 3 weeks due to hamstring injury. Doubt he'll make the Atletico return leg then.

https://www.liverpoolfc.com/news/first-team/387691-jordan-henderson-injury-details-confirmed

[southernboy]

That's a massive blow. He's been unbelievably good this season. It's a shame there's not an international break next week.

[teesred]

Absolute nitemare. He'll be missed but hopefully more starts for Fab means he gets upto speed for the run in.
With the games we have we should be able to cope.

[skyebo]

It may let Keita back in for a few games.

[Nineteenx]

It may let Keita back in for a few games.

Not that there is a silver lining, but if we were looking for a positive in this it has to be that desperately unfortunate as the injury to our talismanic captain fantastic is, it does coincide with Keita being available for play a run of games

[Nineteenx]

Get well soon Captain fantastic, the team desperately needs you back at No6, we have massively missed you and your incredible drive, organisation and distribution already

[ianlfc]

Horrendouson, according to some.

[CCTV]

Horrendouson, according to some.

Horrenderson - get it right :D

Was a great slagging around Halloween iirc

[Nineteenx]

Horrendouson, according to some.

Indeed, even after the second half of last season and the massive change in our ability to win games and the defining moment of the change in course of our season being Henderson coming on away at Southampton at 1-1 loads here wanted to ship him out and give Virgil the arm band in the summer just gone

I don't hugely rely on stats unless they're backed up by what I've seen on the pitch as otherwise they can be grossly misleading, but his stats at No6 were incredible, 4 assists, 8 big chances created and the majority of his 101 successful long passes having been made from there in just 12 games

https://www.premierleague.com/players/3712/Jordan-Henderson/stats?co=1&se=274

[dicko1969]

Missed

[Nineteenx]

Missed

It's pretty straight forward Dicko, if a player is in a position of a player who is out through a forced absence and in that position the player is in POTY form and his presence there has overseen a huge evolution in how the team plays and it's ability to win games and the team's been playing better with him there, you don't take him out as soon as the other player's back, if at all

[Nineteenx]

Captain fantastics record at No6 this season all competitions

P12 W12 D0 L0 GF24 GA2 - clean sheets 10 - times our press or counter press was broken - 2 or 3

At No6 Premier League only Goals 2 Assists 4 big chances created 8 in 10 games

Completed long passes around 80

[miller0863]

Massive miss, desperately need him back ASAP

[teesred]

The biggest "obviousness" since hes been out how really slow we've been at getting the ball forward. Our counters have been few and far between.

[Steveo]

Erm we created zero in Madrid and made Norwich look like friggin Barca at times.. We haven’t played well for a while and Hendo was part of that.

We missed him today - no doubt - BUT that was not why we lost.

[Steveo]

The biggest "obviousness" since hes been out how really slow we've been at getting the ball forward. Our counters have been few and far between.

True but for me - Great teams don’t rely on counters.


Team is smashed mentally - Fatigued - and cant blame them ..FFS it has been coming - so obvious. We have been scraping past shite sides and making them look shit hot.

[teesred]

Yeah it wasnt why we lost for sure, we have missed him since hes been out. Today was just pretty much the ten outfield players having their worst games all season. Especially as a collective but as it's been said a ton already it had been coming for a while.

[Nineteenx]

The biggest "obviousness" since hes been out how really slow we've been at getting the ball forward. Our counters have been few and far between.

It's the complete lack of good distribution and playmaking ability in his absence that has been painfully obvious, people don't give him nearly enough credit, his playmaking has been absolutely superb, as good as I've seen from any player in a Liverpool shirt, it's what I call the 'snapshot' he can look up and instantly see the right ball, that might be the ball over the top for LFWD or RFWD, the switch left or right for either full back, the switch left or right for either LFWD or RFWD, or nothing much on but we have an overload one side, play the longer ball over the top and if it's cleared we'll likely win the second ball or our player gets in front of the defender to lay it off and we start from there, he's been absolutely out of this world and I simply would not have moved him from No6.

He brought fluidity to our midfield 3 and made it incredibly difficult for teams to set up to counter against us because he introduced the rotation of the positions of our midfield 3 when he was at No6 and that made the press and counter press absolutely sensational, all 3 midfielders would rotate through the positions throughout games and cover each others positions and take their counter press positions off whichever player was pressed highest

Fabinho's our high destroyer No6 to stop sides who are better than us with the ball making the play from deep in combination with Bobby when Hendo and Gini sit a little deeper of him, we didn't need him for any of the games he was brought back in for, including Atletico, because we were going to have most of the ball, against City, Barcelona, hell yes we need him, he's essential, but in most games his poor range of passing and distribution sees us struggle to create and makes our midfield too rigid and easy to set up to counter off.

[teesred]

True but for me - Great teams don’t rely on counters.


Team is smashed mentally - Fatigued - and cant blame them ..FFS it has been coming - so obvious. We have been scraping past shite sides and making them look shit hot.

Agree. Ive thought for weeks now that I want it done and dusted asap as we have been getting away with it for ages. Need it done so our nerves aren't shredded.
Imagine if we were only a few points clear, we'd be past ourselves

[Nineteenx]

True but for me - Great teams don’t rely on counters.


Team is smashed mentally - Fatigued - and cant blame them ..FFS it has been coming - so obvious. We have been scraping past shite sides and making them look shit hot.

Yes, but Henderson wasn't all about counters, his playmaking and overall distribution was absolutely sensational, in his absence at No6 players are making runs in which he had been consistently finding them and there's no-one in our midfield to play those passes, now it's taking us 2 or 3 passes to find a full backs run, a midfielder or forward pulling out wide and our build up is incredibly slow and laboured and by the time they are found, they have no space and the opposition have 10 men behind the ball covering all their options

[teesred]

I think someone said it earlier but maybe its time to start relying on the squad again like around the WCC period. We have Minamino and Origi. We should use them.

[Nineteenx]

I think someone said it earlier but maybe its time to start relying on the squad again like around the WCC period. We have Minamino and Origi. We should use them.

WHO is going to make the play?

Gini's brilliant at what he does, but can't make the play and doesn't have a left to right or right to left switch, Fabinho's great at what he does against sides who are better than us with the ball when he plays as a high destroyer, but his distribution and playmaking ability's not of the required standard, he was converted to a DM from being a RB after all and he doesn't have a left to right or right to left switch or a centre to left or centre to right switch either, it's pretty fucking important our midifelders can play those passes given how we use both our attacking full backs

[Insidious]

I think someone said it earlier but maybe its time to start relying on the squad again like around the WCC period. We have Minamino and Origi. We should use them.

If we are using them, can Origi PLEASE go up top and not on the left?

[Steveo]

Yes, but Henderson wasn't all about counters, his playmaking and overall distribution was absolutely sensational, in his absence at No6 players are making runs in which he had been consistently finding them and there's no-one in our midfield to play those passes, now it's taking us 2 or 3 passes to find a full backs run, a midfielder or forward pulling out wide and our build up is incredibly slow and laboured and by the time they are found, they have no space and the opposition have 10 men behind the ball covering all their options

He was superb playing in there no doubt at all - a revelation in fact and let’s be honest - Fabinho has been poor since he came back - so it’s a double whammy losing Hendo and having an off form Fab, but as others have said - the whole team we miles off it today.. Virgil was asleep - Lovren was poor but in truth he was surrounded by absolute dross today.

Felt like Trent’s luck in that FB position well and truly ran out today.

Bad day at office.. Hopefully a kick up the backside

[Steveo]

If we are using them, can Origi PLEASE go up top and not on the left?

This - need a direct forward who is hungry

[Nineteenx]

He was superb playing in there no doubt at all - a revelation in fact and let’s be honest - Fabinho has been poor since he came back - so it’s a double whammy losing Hendo and having an off form Fab, but as others have said - the whole team we miles off it today.. Virgil was asleep - Lovren was poor but let’s be fair he was surrounded by dross today.

So we not only missed his fantastic distribution and organising of the press and counter press, we're very obviously missing his drive, combative nature and leadership and organisational skills to make sure all the other lads are on top of their games too

Edit: He was a revelation and then some :eek: I've always backed him and I know how hard he always works to improve and develop, but he absolutely shocked me, I was completely stunned by what he was producing, loved it, but I was absolutely gobsmacked, he was simply out of this world, it's why I wouldn't have changed it.

In my opinion he also picked up his injury as a result of the change, because the press and counter press was then being broken as it wasn't at the levels it had been both RCM and LCM were suddenly doing longer sprints and more of them to chase back they hadn't been used to doing and your body gets used to playing a certain way, if that's not a recipe for a hamstring tweak, I'm not sure what is

[LEGS]

Fabinho needs these games to bed himself back in the man is quality his form will return.

We cant do anything about the Henderson injury but carry on hopefully he is back for Athletico.

Some people are losing their heads we are still in the mix for 3 trophies and if honest at the start of the season "only" winning the league will make me a very happy man.

We will be back we are too good not to.

[teesred]

WHO is going to make the play?

Gini's brilliant at what he does, but can't make the play and doesn't have a left to right or right to left switch, Fabinho's great at what he does against sides who are better than us with the ball when he plays as a high destroyer, but his distribution and playmaking ability's not of the required standard, he was converted to a DM from being a RB after all and he doesn't have a left to right or right to left switch or a centre to left or centre to right switch either, it's pretty fucking important our midifelders can play those passes given how we use both our attacking full backs

Well hopefully Hendo comes back in the next couple of games and we still have Trent and Robbo.
The front 3 just looks like it needs shaking up a bit. That might just be me knee jerking after today but as a unit they haven't looked "on it" for a while but I guess you could say that about all of them.
I said to my mate when the game kicked off that you know when you're hitting the "business end" of the season when it's still daylight on a late kick off.
We need to rest some of the players who play non stop. Milner should be back soon also, that means Robbo may get a rest.

[CCTV]

Erm we created zero in Madrid and made Norwich look like friggin Barca at times.. We haven’t played well for a while and Hendo was part of that.

We missed him today - no doubt - BUT that was not why we lost.

Agree. Imo our patterns of play today were awful. Too predictable. When up against the lower block we are failing to engage them centrally and all they've to do is focus on the wide areas which they seemed primed to attack.
Same in madrid that 4 in front of their back r was rarely shifted around. Need to be braver in the middle and play some football.

[Nineteenx]

Fabinho needs these games to bed himself back in the man is quality his form will return.

We cant do anything about the Henderson injury but carry on hopefully he is back for Athletico.

Some people are losing their heads we are still in the mix for 3 trophies and if honest at the start of the season "only" winning the league will make me a very happy man.

We will be back we are too good not to.

I'm not losing my head, I warned about changing the midfield and bringing Fabinho straight back in when fit because the team had evolved in his absence and he doesn't have the distribution Hendo had provided and he doesn't facilitate our midfield 3 rotating positions throughout games to make us more fluid and he doesn't play right across the line across the entire width of the pitch.

From what I have seen and it really stunned me, Henderson is our undisputed No6 by a considerable distance, Fabinho's for games like City or Barca and other teams who are going to have more of the ball and try and pass you to death as a high destroyer, in today's game it was like how teams have played against City's full backs this season when Fabinho had the ball, nobody bothering to press them, like, ok you have it, what are you going to do with it? In games in which we're going to dominate the ball or have most of it, we need a No6 who can pass the damned thing more than 10 yards

[CCTV]

Fabinho needs these games to bed himself back in the man is quality his form will return.

We cant do anything about the Henderson injury but carry on hopefully he is back for Athletico.

Some people are losing their heads we are still in the mix for 3 trophies and if honest at the start of the season "only" winning the league will make me a very happy man.

We will be back we are too good not to.

I'm rather similar. Bit snobbish about the fa cup, if we win it great if not I'm not bothered.

The league will be enough. But we've a great opportunity to retain our cl title.

What's pissed me off was our performance and post match reaction v Atletico. Today should right that as it was a case of so many errors and poor patterns.

[LEGS]

Im not saying you are wrong about Henderson you are not on your own ive known for 5-6 years how good he is.

Im talking people saying Lovren was awful he needs to go etc my point is he has played 9 OL games we have W8 L1 and secondly you arent getting a 4th CB better than him.

Today we got hammered I am not going to whine about it as these things happen.

[CCTV]

@19 hendo had put in huge amounts of effort in recent weeks and months. I suggested resting him for Norwich and having him primed for Atletico.
It's a bit much imo to suggest that his injury is down to playing at rcm.

[Nineteenx]

Erm we created zero in Madrid and made Norwich look like friggin Barca at times.. We haven’t played well for a while and Hendo was part of that.

We missed him today - no doubt - BUT that was not why we lost.

No, the not playing well started v Southampton, we ended up winning 4-0 but could easily have lost that game, all of a sudden our press and counter press was being broken easily when it had rarely been broken at all in the previous 8 Premier League games and that's where the players making the runs they'd been making for the last 2 months and had been being found in were suddenly making them and not being picked out. There's a considerable difference between having Hendo in the team at RCM No8 and at No6 in how much he can use the distribution he showed at No6 to influence the game and his orchestrating the press and counter press and playing across the entire width and length of the pitch

[teesred]

I'm rather similar. Bit snobbish about the fa cup, if we win it great if not I'm not bothered.

The league will be enough. But we've a great opportunity to retain our cl title.

What's pissed me off was our performance and post match reaction v Atletico. Today should right that as it was a case of so many errors and poor patterns.

Agree, not that arsed about the FA cup. Wouldn't be bothered if plenty of starters are given a rssr and the likes of Orgi,Mino,Shaq,Jones etc play.
You're right about the reaction. It should have been against west ham.

[Insidious]

For those who are feeling a little glum after that loss, myself included, let's remember this.

Four years ago our rivals were laughing at us for finishing 8th in the League.

Indeed, in 15/16 we lost ten League games.

Any rival fans laughing tonight are delighted that Liverpool lost their second League game of the last sixty-six League games.

Let's see what can be done against Chelsea in the Cup that we're still in.

Let's see if we can beat Bournemouth, which would leave us just three wins away from a LEAGUE TITLE.

Then let's get the side ready for Atletico at the Cathedral where our worshippers have so much influence.

[Nineteenx]

@19 hendo had put in huge amounts of effort in recent weeks and months. I suggested resting him for Norwich and having him primed for Atletico.
It's a bit much imo to suggest that his injury is down to playing at rcm.

Why is it? For 2 months he'd been orchestrating the press and counter press and the midfield had been more fluid and rotating positions to cover each other to conserve energy, be more fluid and stop each other having to make numerous long sprints during games to get back, because the press and counter press were rarely ever broken and if a player was furthest forward pressing, another player was deeper covering that area, so they made the odd sprint over a much shorter distance. 2 months your body gets used to playing a certain way, Henderson for all the ground he covered rarely had to hit a full sprint at any time in that 2 months

Then. enter Fabinho, no midfield rotation, players positions in midfield more definitely fixed, Fabinho isn't a true Dm and doesn't play right across the line and he is the most guilty of allowing our press and counter press to be broken, so suddenly, because he's not covering the space behind them, LCM and RCM are making more full on sprints a game over a longer distance

[dicko1969]

True but for me - Great teams don’t rely on counters.


Team is smashed mentally - Fatigued - and cant blame them ..FFS it has been coming - so obvious. We have been scraping past shite sides and making them look shit hot.

Steveo I think the first time I have agreed with you in 12 years 🤣🤣🤣🤣

[dicko1969]

Why is it? For 2 months he'd been orchestrating the press and counter press and the midfield had been more fluid and rotating positions to cover each other to conserve energy, be more fluid and stop each other having to make numerous long sprints during games to get back, because the press and counter press were rarely ever broken and if a player was furthest forward pressing, another player was deeper covering that area, so they made the odd sprint over a much shorter distance. 2 months your body gets used to playing a certain way, Henderson for all the ground he covered rarely had to hit a full sprint at any time in that 2 months

Then. enter Fabinho, no midfield rotation, players positions in midfield more definitely fixed, Fabinho isn't a true Dm and doesn't play right across the line and he is the most guilty of allowing our press and counter press to be broken, so suddenly, because he's not covering the space behind them, LCM and RCM are making more full on sprints a game over a longer distance

What is Fabinho if not a cdm ?
Right back?

[dicko1969]

I'm rather similar. Bit snobbish about the fa cup, if we win it great if not I'm not bothered.

The league will be enough. But we've a great opportunity to retain our cl title.

What's pissed me off was our performance and post match reaction v Atletico. Today should right that as it was a case of so many errors and poor patterns.

Milner and Henderson not here
I blame VVD and Klopp
Lovren captain 100%

[dicko1969]

I'm not losing my head, I warned about changing the midfield and bringing Fabinho straight back in when fit because the team had evolved in his absence and he doesn't have the distribution Hendo had provided and he doesn't facilitate our midfield 3 rotating positions throughout games to make us more fluid and he doesn't play right across the line across the entire width of the pitch.

From what I have seen and it really stunned me, Henderson is our undisputed No6 by a considerable distance, Fabinho's for games like City or Barca and other teams who are going to have more of the ball and try and pass you to death as a high destroyer, in today's game it was like how teams have played against City's full backs this season when Fabinho had the ball, nobody bothering to press them, like, ok you have it, what are you going to do with it? In games in which we're going to dominate the ball or have most of it, we need a No6 who can pass the damned thing more than 10 yards

Agreed... chop and change
But we have to
Injuries
Suspensions
Rotation

Fabinho back is not the same pre injury

But that's football. Form and confidence

Tbh Lallana made things happen today
That the other 3 midfielders didn't do

Oh ps ffs keita

[CCTV]

Milner and Henderson not here
I blame VVD and Klopp
Lovren captain 100%

Milner off the bench would have been a great option. Often steadied the ship even when Hendo started in some of our previous games. Lallana did well but you can always rely on Milner to make an impact and crunchy an opponent.

Tbh Virgil has his part in 2 of their goals, bit lazy on the first though not all on him and on the second he's playing ref while the pacey sarr gets in behind him.

Lovren not great not the worst.

Think our 2 8s played a massive role in our poor build up play today and lately our 8s have been poor in the system.
Front 3 poor too.

[Nineteenx]

Fabinho back is not the same pre injury

Yes, but Henderson at No6 was miles better than Fabinho at his best at No6, that's the point, football changes, players work hard to improve, Henderson raised himself well above the levels of anything Fabinho has ever produced at No6.

Here is 'Fabinho dominating everyone'

JV8ZDaFjkTo

How many instances in Fabinho dominating everyone are him sprinting back to tackle a player who he has allowed to break our press or counter press? How often did any player at all break our press or counter press in his absence? Hardly ever at all

[CCTV]

Why is it? For 2 months he'd been orchestrating the press and counter press and the midfield had been more fluid and rotating positions to cover each other to conserve energy, be more fluid and stop each other having to make numerous long sprints during games to get back, because the press and counter press were rarely ever broken and if a player was furthest forward pressing, another player was deeper covering that area, so they made the odd sprint over a much shorter distance. 2 months your body gets used to playing a certain way, Henderson for all the ground he covered rarely had to hit a full sprint at any time in that 2 months

Then. enter Fabinho, no midfield rotation, players positions in midfield more definitely fixed, Fabinho isn't a true Dm and doesn't play right across the line and he is the most guilty of allowing our press and counter press to be broken, so suddenly, because he's not covering the space behind them, LCM and RCM are making more full on sprints a game over a longer distance

He'd had a busy schedule, then a break and Atletico away was always going to be a heavy load.

I disagree with your views on Fabinho/Gomez, think our 8s have been an issue tactically, but if you really see it that way, why were you so opposed to resting Hendo given your rationalisations?

[Nineteenx]

He'd had a busy schedule, then a break and Atletico away was always going to be a heavy load.

I disagree with your views on Fabinho/Gomez, think our 8s have been an issue tactically, but if you really see it that way, why were you so opposed to resting Hendo given your rationalisations?

I was opposed to Fabinho coming back in at all, until we played a Barca, City or Bayern, why can you not recognise the next level playmaking, pressing and counter pressing and evolution of the team in Fabinho's absence, far too many people on Fabinho's dick wildly overrating him because he wasn't Henderson, Henderson pissed all over anything Fabinho had ever produced at No6, period

[CCTV]

I was opposed to Fabinho coming back in at all, until we played a Barca, City or Bayern, why can you not recognise the next level playmaking, pressing and counter pressing and evolution of the team in Fabinho's absence, far too many people on Fabinho's dick wildly overrating him because he wasn't Henderson, Henderson pissed all over anything Fabinho had ever produced at No6, period

Imo our best midfield is Fabinho plays 6 and Hendo rcm. It worked well beforehand in many games.

Your saying that with Fabinho at 6 you see all these disasters and are blaming Fabinho at 6 for Hendos injury as he has to make many more sprints.
Yet you were opposed to resting Hendo v Norwich and having him primed for Atletico when you say he has such a heavier workload. Doesnt make much sense what you're suggesting.

I wanted to rest Hendo v Norwich as he was our in form midfielder and vital he was fresh and able to play 90 mins in madrid.
Fab back from injury, Gini not at the same level of form as Hendo and our other 8s not in great form either.

For me a lot of our problems stem from our 8s presently, not playing enough football through the middle when we have possession.

[Nineteenx]

Imo our best midfield is Fabinho plays 6 and Hendo rcm. It worked well beforehand in many games.

Your saying that with Fabinho at 6 you see all these disasters and are blaming Fabinho at 6 for Hendos injury as he has to make many more sprints.
Yet you were opposed to resting Hendo v Norwich and having him primed for Atletico when you say he has such a heavier workload. Doesnt make much sense what you're suggesting.

I wanted to rest Hendo v Norwich as he was our in form midfielder and vital he was fresh and able to play 90 mins in madrid.
Fab back from injury, Gini not at the same level of form as Hendo and our other 8s not in great form either.

For me a lot of our problems stem from our 8s presently, not playing enough football through the middle when we have possession.

Hendo's workload and in particular in full on sprints is greater as a No8 with Fabinho at No6 than when he's playing No6 himself, because when he plays No6 he orchestrated the press better, we have the rotation of the 3 midfielders covering each others positions during games so none of them have to make huge sprints and all of them get to conserve more energy.

Prior to Fabinho's injury our best midfield was with Fabinho at No6 and Hendo at No8 RCM but Hendo changed all that with his performances at No6 and how they complimented the team and pushed us to higher levels than we had ever played with Fabinho at No6.

It's football, things change, players work really fucking hard to develop and improve, a player picks up and injury, another player who's been working really hard and understands the strengths and weaknesses of all the other players and the system comes in for them and plays well above the level they have ever performed there, it happens all the time in football, the trick is to recognise and accept it has happened and continue evolving and developing and not to go backwards

Players can't be picked on the merits of what they did last season or on the merits of what they did prior to being out for 2 months if a player has come in and out performed what they have done

If we have a game v City, Barca, Bayern then Fabinho at No6 high destroyer yes, in most games, for the vastly superior benefits of the distribution and playmaking from No6 and orchestrating a far superior press and counter press and the rotation of the midfield 3 during the game so it's less easy to set up to try and counter press off any of them against sides sitting back looking to counter when we're going to have most of the ball Henderson all day long every single day of the week

[Steveo]

Steveo I think the first time I have agreed with you in 12 years 🤣🤣🤣🤣

Everyone sees the light eventually my friend.. :D

[Nineteenx]

Each to their own anyway, there are numerous examples of injuries to players thought of as key players or regular starters being injured and in their absence managers inadvertently stumbling upon their best side, it's happened a fair bit in the history of the game. Player comes in and delivers POTY form consistently and drive the entire team to higher levels, you take him out? Each to their own, not for me

A bit of an extreme case, but let's take the case of Gareth Bale, was bought by Spurs as a LB, was consistently shit, I think they lost every game he played in at LB, I think Niko Kranjčar got injured and they were short of cover in that area so Redknapp threw Bale in, he played out of his skin and delivered performances no-one had ever expected, Redknapp kept him in as a result of those performances and the rest is history

[Nineteenx]

What is Fabinho if not a cdm ?
Right back?

I think in the high destroyer role, against sides who will try and dominate the ball against us, like City. Barca, Bayern, PSG he is absolutely ideal, he is a DM converted from RB, so he is never going to have the distribution or playmaking ability of a midfielder, he also doesn't play right across the line, he plays quite rigidly central in a specific area that means the other midfielders are restricted too.


--------------Fabinho--------------

--------------------------Henderson-------------------------

So Fabinho will play in a more central area of about that width of the pitch compared with Henderson's being the entire width of the pitch and Henderson will play almost the full length of the pitch, whereas Fabinho from just outside our box up to about 10 yards outside the opposition box

[Nineteenx]

Number 1 is Henderson, number 2 is Henderson, number 3 is Henderson, number 4 is Henderson.........................

Dear Hendo, you are in my thoughts and prayers, I am praying that you are fit to return and start at No6 v Atletico as i really want us to retain the Champions League

God speed your recovery my captain fantastic

[dicko1969]

Strangely we coped without Alisson

Tbh

Its Hendo and VVD we cannot cope without

[Nineteenx]

Strangely we coped without Alisson

Tbh

Its Hendo and VVD we cannot cope without

Nail on the head Dicko, nail on the head, that's why we need Soumare in the summer, we need another Hendo type, desperately, too many attacking No8's in our ranks, we don't need a Grealish or Cantwell, it's the last thing we fucking need, a Fabian Ruiz who can play as an attacking or holding No8 or a RFWD, yes we need that too

[dicko1969]

Grealish wont fit in for what our midfield does

Cantwell disappears more than Gini and has the strength of Keita

Sounare Werner Sancho havertz Upamecano

[southernboy]

We really have missed Henderson in the last 2 games. I would only play him against Atletico if he’s 100% fit. Absolutely no point rushing him back unless he’s ready.

[fiordearg]

Henderson is our most important player

[Nineteenx]

We've missed Henderson at No6 since the Southampton game to be fair

CCTV loves his stats so I have some for him:

Henderson at No6 all competitions P13 W13 D0 L0 GF25 GA2 Clean sheets 11 Team failed to score 0 (zero)

Draws - Zero

Losses - Zero

Failed to score - Zero

Fabinho at No6 all competitions P25 W18 D3 L4 GF52 GA31 Clean sheets 3 (THREE) Team failed to score 4 (FOUR)

Draws - The filthy away - Napoli - Shrewsbury away FA Cup

Losses - Napoli - Atletico - Watford - Chelsea FA Cup

Failed to score - Napoli - Atletico - Watford - Chelsea FA Cup

I've got to say, the evidence is compelling and damning

[dicko1969]

Henderson is our most important player

Repeat x100

[dicko1969]

We've missed Henderson at No6 since the Southampton game to be fair

CCTV loves his stats so I have some for him:

Henderson at No6 all competitions P13 W13 D0 L0 GF25 GA2 Clean sheets 11 Team failed to score 0 (zero)

Draws - Zero

Losses - Zero

Failed to score - Zero

Fabinho at No6 all competitions P25 W18 D3 L4 GF52 GA31 Clean sheets 3 (THREE) Team failed to score 4 (FOUR)

Draws - The filthy away - Napoli - Shrewsbury away FA Cup

Losses - Napoli - Atletico - Watford - Chelsea FA Cup

Failed to score - Napoli - Atletico - Watford - Chelsea FA Cup

I've got to say, the evidence is compelling and damning

What is worrying is we arent scoring

Soon the itk will be saying our midfield isnt creating

Bring back Coutinho hahaha

I think other teams are working out to block us

Taa robbo wide/ block
Long ball in channels/ block
Front 3 struggling
Mid 3 getting out run out thought
Back 4 looking vulnerable

I think Jurgen and his mates need a rethink and slightly different approach

[Nineteenx]

What is worrying is we arent scoring

Soon the itk will be saying our midfield isnt creating

Bring back Coutinho hahaha

I think other teams are working out to block us

Taa robbo wide/ block
Long ball in channels/ block
Front 3 struggling
Mid 3 getting out run out thought
Back 4 looking vulnerable

I think Jurgen and his mates need a rethink and slightly different approach

The not scoring only started when we changed the midfield, since Fabinho returned to No6 we've failed to score in 3 out of the 5 games, we're missing Hendo's distribution and creativity from No6 too

[dicko1969]

I understand
We had a settled team

Back 5 (Gomez)
Mid 3
Ox/millie Hendo Gini
Front 3

Since then only Hendo out has changed

His drive and determination
Also if Hendo out Milner is there to also do that.

Both out we look lacking leaders
Surprisingly VVD doesn't seem so much of a captain marvel

[teesred]

What is worrying is we arent scoring

Soon the itk will be saying our midfield isnt creating

Bring back Coutinho hahaha

I think other teams are working out to block us

Taa robbo wide/ block
Long ball in channels/ block
Front 3 struggling
Mid 3 getting out run out thought
Back 4 looking vulnerable

I think Jurgen and his mates need a rethink and slightly different approach

The midfield is rarely creative especially if Hendo isnt there, its zero without him. The creativity comes from the full backs most of the time. Robbo looks jaded as does Trent at times.
Thos is our wobble. It was going to happen. It's just has to be a little one.
Win against Bournemouth and we'll feel differently about the Atletico game but at the moment it's not a feeling of confidence. If we go through though it's a different ball game altogether. Gives everyone a boost, get the remaining wins needed for our first PL title which at this point now is feeling like a chore to get it over the line.
It absolutely 100 god damn percent will not feel like that when the whistle goes in the game that wins it.
We'll all be in dreamland.

[teesred]

Nail on the head Dicko, nail on the head, that's why we need Soumare in the summer, we need another Hendo type, desperately, too many attacking No8's in our ranks, we don't need a Grealish or Cantwell, it's the last thing we fucking need, a Fabian Ruiz who can play as an attacking or holding No8 or a RFWD, yes we need that too

We need a creative midfielder or a lock picking player, we have not replaced Coutinho's creativity and it needs to come back in some form.
We need to add a different aspect to our game as it feels like we've gone a bit stale I think.
In my opinion Grealish fits that bill.

[Nineteenx]

The midfield is rarely creative especially if Hendo isnt there, its zero without him. The creativity comes from the full backs most of the time. Robbo looks jaded as does Trent at times.
Thos is our wobble. It was going to happen. It's just has to be a little one.
Win against Bournemouth and we'll feel differently about the Atletico game but at the moment it's not a feeling of confidence. If we go through though it's a different ball game altogether. Gives everyone a boost, get the remaining wins needed for our first PL title which at this point now is feeling like a chore to get it over the line.
It absolutely 100 god damn percent will not feel like that when the whistle goes in the game that wins it.
We'll all be in dreamland.

Gini 3 goals 0 assists
Fabinho 1 goal 1 assist
Keita 2 goals 1 assists (vastly less appearances 1 goal 1 assist in the Prem in 9 appearances 1 goal in Champions League in 4 1 goal and 1 assist in the CWC I think too)
Oxlade 6 goals 0 assists (3 League 3 Champions league
Hendo 3 goals 5 assists (2 goals and 4 assists coming in 13 games at No6)

[teesred]

Gini 3 goals 0 assists
Fabinho 1 goal 1 assist
Keita 2 goals 1 assists (vastly less appearances 1 goal 1 assist in the Prem in 9 appearances 1 goal in Champions League in 4 1 goal and 1 assist in the CWC I think too)
Oxlade 6 goals 0 assists (3 League 3 Champions league
Hendo 3 goals 5 assists (2 goals and 4 assists coming in 13 games at No6)

Not a vast amount to be fair. Ox scored 2 in one game against Genk also. 8 goals between him and Keita is a poor return
My point is as a unit our midfield doesn't create many chances for the forwards. We dont have a creative element to it, it's a good midfield but it lacks cutting edge in terms of chances made. They should do more when you consider the amount of possession we have.

[Nineteenx]

We need a creative midfielder or a lock picking player, we have not replaced Coutinho's creativity and it needs to come back in some form.
We need to add a different aspect to our game as it feels like we've gone a bit stale I think.
In my opinion Grealish fits that bill.

I think we need another box to box midfielder - Soumare
I think Fabian Ruiz fits the bill for the greater creativity far better than Grealish and would probably cost the same, maybe a bit less - He's an absolute shoe in for our LCM spot and as a natural left footer what he'll add will be incredible, that he is also a cracking player at RFWD would mean that together with Werner, our front 3 is sorted when Mane and Mo are away at AFCON

I don't just randomly pick x or y rated player from anywhere, I see the links, I watch them in full games, I imagine them playing in our set up and how they'd fit in, look for similarities to existing players in some aspects of what they do, I watch them in full games to look at pressing, counter pressing, tackles, recoveries, all the things data analysis looks at and all the things our players do well.

With any midfielder, because our switching the ball is very important and doing it very quickly when the player is in space or moving up into it is vital I really specifically look to see if they have that ball and others in their repertoire and if they are the quality they need to be and both Soumare and Fabian Ruiz have them in abundance along with many other hugely desirable qualities, they both have the balls our full backs and forwards thrive off that only Hendo of our current midfield has, so for me, they are both exactly what we need

Edit: I also take into account players playing their natural game as Jurgen seems to put great stock in this, you don't know if it is their natural game however or if how they play is on instruction from their manager and coaches, but if they are playing like that for a couple of seasons, it becomes their natural way of playing, so I'm looking at that too and they both fit on that account also

When I watch Grealish, he doesn't look like he fits in to what we do at all, rarely plays switches, when he does they're in the air way too long so their intended target has a player on top of them by the time the ball arrives at them and he doesn't strike them as he should to make them easily controlled, none of what he does appears to fit our patterns so his natural games doesn't fit for me

[Nineteenx]

Not a vast amount to be fair. Ox scored 2 in one game against Genk also. 8 goals between him and Keita is a poor return
My point is as a unit our midfield doesn't create many chances for the forwards. We dont have a creative element to it, it's a good midfield but it lacks cutting edge in terms of chances made. They should do more when you consider the amount of possession we have.

Hendo's the only creative one, he has numerous passes before the assist where he's released a player to make the assist and another 6 big chances created at just 13 games at No6 the player he put in really should have fucking scored

If you look at his 13 games at No6 he had 2 goals and 4 assists, should have scored another 2 (De Gea brilliantly denied him one) had another 6 our forwards should have buried missed and played at least 8 balls before the assist. Meaning he was in some part heavily involved in almost every goal we scored when he was playing there, that is incredible in just 13 games there.

Think about this, but for the glorious chances missed and the missed opportunities or ones saved from Hendo himself he could very easily have a record of P13 Goals 4 Assists 10 at No6 along with his 8 passes before the assist

Trent only has 4 assists from open play this season I think :eek: shows how hard teams have been working on stopping our full backs and why we need to bring those 2 midfielders in during the summer and get Matip back in at RCB so he can convert more corners and help Virgil convert more

[teesred]

Hendo's the only creative one, he has numerous passes before the assist where he's released a player to make the assist and another 6 big chances created at just 13 games at No6 the player he put in really should have fucking scored

If you look at his 13 games at No6 he had 2 goals and 4 assists, should have scored another 2 (De Gea brilliantly denied him one) had another 6 our forwards should have buried missed and played at least 8 balls before the assist. Meaning he was in some part heavily involved in almost every goal we scored when he was playing there, that is incredible in just 13 games there.

Think about this, but for the glorious chances missed and the missed opportunities or ones saved from Hendo himself he could very easily have a record of P13 Goals 4 Assists 10 at No6 along with his 8 passes before the assist

Trent only has 4 assists from open play this season I think :eek: shows how hard teams have been working on stopping our full backs and why we need to bring those 2 midfielders in during the summer and get Matip back in at RCB so he can convert more corners and help Virgil convert more

Yeah I read that about Trent only having 4 from open play, I was surprised by that.
Agree totally on Hendo, whoever's comes in needs to work around him.
I reckon Soumare would be half the price of Grealish.

[TheDOC1979]

Remember the time when Henderson received a red card (the Gerrard slip year) he was out for three games and we felt his absence then. A lot underestimate his actual worth to the team.