CommonSense v CummingsSense

[scientificred]

I hear a lot about people being asked to exercise common sense (which maybe not very common) as a means to help prevent the spread of the virus - just follow the 'very clear' guidelines.
But I am also hearing more and more about people flouting the guidelines claiming it was OK for Dominoc Cummings to do something against those guidelines and so why should they adhere to such guidelines.
I have not heard use before of this similar statement and am wondering why the opposition has not picked up on it - it could be quite useful as a rhetorical tool.
Perhaps they or yourselves have already thought of it and dismissed its power or useability.
If you have then apologies but here it is again...
Common sense v Cummings sense

[RedNoodle]

I think you'll probably find that there have been many notable people, representing various political organisations who have said and done things during this epidemic that they shouldn't have done, meaning that if they start pointing fingers they will be told "those in glass houses ......" .

[scientificred]

I don't watch PMQs that often but Starmer seems to never get any answers out of BJ but gets ridiculed with statements like 'he's got more briefs than Kalvin Klein' or 'more flip-flops than Bournemouth beach'.
Not a politician myself but could he use that statement to good effect ?
'Is the PM asking us to apply Cummings sense ?'

[RedNoodle]

Virtually all politicians (and big business owners) are self serving so and so's. The sooner people realise/accept that, the sooner we can do something about it. Thinking that any of them, or any particular groups of them are better than any others is the thinking of the brainwashed masses.

[redebreck]

If we in the UK were french, or similar, I genuinely believe that we would have had a revolution, because of the way the upper classes treat the general population.

[RedNoodle]

If we in the UK were french, or similar, I genuinely believe that we would have had a revolution, because of the way the upper classes treat the general population.

The thing is it's not just the upper classes. It's also the middle classes/anyone who lives a life of reasonable wealth and privilege. They all like to preach to and condemn those who they see as 'beneath' them, usually about things that do not affect those doing the preaching and condemning, largely/entirely as a consequence of their wealth and privilege.

[CCTV]

And they say the left cant meme...

[CCTV]

The thing is it's not just the upper classes. It's also the middle classes/anyone who lives a life of reasonable wealth and privilege. They all like to preach to and condemn those who they see as 'beneath' them, usually about things that do not affect those doing the preaching and condemning, largely/entirely as a consequence of their wealth and privilege.

If youre alive today you are largely priviliged imo, people i believe seem to be continually ungrateful for what they have and completely destroyed by what they dont have.

[RedNoodle]

If youre alive today you are largely priviliged imo, people i believe seem to be continually ungrateful for what they have and completely destroyed by what they dont have.

I would beg to differ on that point. I would also suggest that you/anyone else who hasn't been subjected to some of the horrific things that a fair few others have would think very differently about this perceived 'priviledge' if you happened to have been through the same things that we/they have.

I've been/am/will be going through many things that I wouldn't individually (never mind collectively) wish upon my worst enemy. Things that have had a permanently devastating impact on my life, never mind the horrific things I've seen a fair few others go through, some on a daily basis.

[CCTV]

I would beg to differ on that point. I would also suggest that you/anyone else who hasn't been subjected to some of the horrific things that a fair few others have would think very differently about this perceived 'priviledge' if you happened to have been through the same things that we/they have.

I've been/am/will be going through many things that I wouldn't individually (never mind collectively) wish upon my worst enemy. Things that have had a permanently devastating impact on my life, never mind the horrific things I've seen a fair few others go through, some on a daily basis.

With your ailments and negative life experiences/events to contend with, there is hardly a better time for you to be alive than today.
Perhaps in the post ww2 era you might have had a better and more stable society in ways, but youd be devoid of technological innovations.

You have electricity, a flushing toilet, relatively stable supply of food, access to some level of healthcare, perhaps some social benefits or income, internet access and devices to avail of the web.

My post was and is aimed in this direction and more generally.

What other time would you prefer to be living your life through ?
Or what is it about the modern world that riles you, i can imagine knife crime and a fair few other aspects that would grate naturally enough.

[CCTV]

I have a fair few beefs with the modern world, but Im not sure i can take the priviliges of today for granted.

[RedNoodle]

With your ailments and negative life experiences/events to contend with, there is hardly a better time for you to be alive than today.

Perhaps in the post ww2 era you might have had a better and more stable society in ways, but youd be devoid of technological innovations.

You have electricity, a flushing toilet, relatively stable supply of food, access to some level of healthcare, perhaps some social benefits or income, internet access and devices to avail of the web.

My post was and is aimed in this direction and more generally.

What other time would you prefer to be living your life through ?
Or what is it about the modern world that riles you, i can imagine knife crime and a fair few other aspects that would grate naturally enough.

There has never been a better time to be a survivor of genocide, but I still wouldn't downplay the horrific nature and consequences of such events. I was going to mention this in another thread, but I watch a lot of videos, including about people travelling around various countries where life is a lot 'tougher' than say here in the UK. I see people struggling to make ends meet, working long hours in dangerous conditions to put food on the table and to keep a roof over their heads, yet I would still swap many of their positions with mine if given the chance. Why? Because despite life being tough for them in many ways, they are often still happy because despite having to endure/overcome various difficult things they still have/experience many of the things that truly do make life worth living. Things such as having nice food, entertainment on tap, a decent place to live etc don't count for anywhere near as much as you might think when a lot, if not all of the things that really matter are missing, and in some cases always have been and always will be.

Many ailments are effectively as problematic as they always have been, especially rare (or in my case mega rare) conditions which very, very few doctors are even aware of, never mind actually trying to do something about it e.g. I have a condition which on its own makes me approximately 1 in 70 million people. Despite that, do you know when my next appointment is/was supposed to be? Eighteen months away. I've also had possibly as many as three surgeries cancelled/postponed. So much for living at a great time. For a condition that is five times less likely than winning the lottery that on its own isn't exactly great, especially given the horrific impact that alone has had/does have on my life.

The unfairness of life riles me. Namely the fact that countless good people will have to endure a life of pain and difficulty, if indeed they get any life at all. Imagine how many good, talented people will never get to make the most of their life, or to have as positive impact on the world and those living on it as they could/should have done. Then you contrast that to the seemingly increasing amount of a-holes that sail through life, often causing grief for many of those former people.

[stevie harkness]

I have a fair few beefs with the modern world, but Im not sure i can take the priviliges of today for granted.

Not everyone thinks flush toilets are a good thing:

https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/07360932.2017.1387864

[CCTV]

There has never been a better time to be a survivor of genocide, but I still wouldn't downplay the horrific nature and consequences of such events. I was going to mention this in another thread, but I watch a lot of videos, including about people travelling around various countries where life is a lot 'tougher' than say here in the UK. I see people struggling to make ends meet, working long hours in dangerous conditions to put food on the table and to keep a roof over their heads, yet I would still swap many of their positions with mine if given the chance. Why? Because despite life being tough for them in many ways, they are often still happy because despite having to endure/overcome various difficult things they still have/experience many of the things that truly do make life worth living. Things such as having nice food, entertainment on tap, a decent place to live etc don't count for anywhere near as much as you might think when a lot, if not all of the things that really matter are missing, and in some cases always have been and always will be.

Many ailments are effectively as problematic as they always have been, especially rare (or in my case mega rare) conditions which very, very few doctors are even aware of, never mind actually trying to do something about it e.g. I have a condition which on its own makes me approximately 1 in 70 million people. Despite that, do you know when my next appointment is/was supposed to be? Eighteen months away. I've also had possibly as many as three surgeries cancelled/postponed. So much for living at a great time. For a condition that is five times less likely than winning the lottery that on its own isn't exactly great, especially given the horrific impact that alone has had/does have on my life.

The unfairness of life riles me. Namely the fact that countless good people will have to endure a life of pain and difficulty, if indeed they get any life at all. Imagine how many good, talented people will never get to make the most of their life, or to have as positive impact on the world and those living on it as they could/should have done. Then you contrast that to the seemingly increasing amount of a-holes that sail through life, often causing grief for many of those former people.

I can accept that living in a more rustic and labour intensive society with good health, family, friends, lower crime could be a preferable lifestyle than how you view/live yours presently.
My point or claim would be that whether in your circumstance or the other circumstance both are better off today than at other points in history.

Your condition sounds pretty rare alright 1of 100 people in the world rare, not sure i accept the odds of the lotto just to be pedantic. I cant recall the odds of picking a winner there tbh.

But at what other point in time do you think would be a better time to be getting treatments. Seems odd to speculate that their would have been better abilities in the 1950s just to go back a shortwhile in human history.
I can understand your frustration/dissapointment with surgeries being cancelled and the waiting list, but id contend the lack of perfection/betterness of todays system isnt exactly a robust rebuttal of my claim that you are better off today than in any other era.

Lifes not fair or perfect, indeed, it is a struggle. Can you give some examples, just to get a flavour of who youre talking about ?

[CCTV]

Not everyone thinks flush toilets are a good thing:

https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/07360932.2017.1387864

Well in the manner of gratitude, thank you for this article. I read it in full and encountered a new word, convivial, though im not sure it is an apt use in contrast with industrial.

While theres a lot of discussion and claims in the article i cant but help feel there are 2 glaring errors, having tried to google in search of it as a joke journal to no avail (i still have my suspicions)
1 batman never said that re mispelling bateman
2 the thesis that there is a damage of colon via hygiene associated with the modern toilet seems incorrect.

Were people to use a toilet with greater focus on hygiene, then they would hover over the seat/bowl and squat supporting their own weight.
I'd argue that it is the hedonistic want of sharing a toilet seat and connecting buttcheeks via the toilet seat that led to the damage of colons and associated cancer not cited in the article. This is a matter of utilisation of the toilet rather than a requirement of using the device, the seat might be alluring but youd want to be a barbarian/daredevil to actually sit on it.

Having visited a sewerage treatment facility when i was quite young, id suggest that there is a misconception around the resource to waste issue. The facility screeds the resource and actually harvests most of the fecal matter. A mere small percentage diluted in water gets wasted as run off. Important knowledge for fishermen/women/pixiekins to know where these dumping points are.
Finally if you want to use shit as a manure, youd be far better off using cow shit than human shit.

I would also like to take a moment of personal privilige to raise the leave no trace concerns over bad pre-industrial forms of shitting.
For example in canada they have a lot of wilderness visitors in the winter. These people tend to need to take a shite on their trips. They typically just squat and dump. Then when the snow recedes and the flow of water occurs this accumulates in a flow of untreated 'resources' poisoning the water tables.
The correct method is to dig a trench about 6 inches deep into the soil. Take a shit, cover over shit and depart. The soil, bacteria, will get rid of it in a matter of days.

[RedNoodle]

I can accept that living in a more rustic and labour intensive society with good health, family, friends, lower crime could be a preferable lifestyle than how you view/live yours presently.
My point or claim would be that whether in your circumstance or the other circumstance both are better off today than at other points in history.

Your condition sounds pretty rare alright 1of 100 people in the world rare, not sure i accept the odds of the lotto just to be pedantic. I cant recall the odds of picking a winner there tbh.

But at what other point in time do you think would be a better time to be getting treatments. Seems odd to speculate that their would have been better abilities in the 1950s just to go back a shortwhile in human history.
I can understand your frustration/dissapointment with surgeries being cancelled and the waiting list, but id contend the lack of perfection/betterness of todays system isnt exactly a robust rebuttal of my claim that you are better off today than in any other era.

Lifes not fair or perfect, indeed, it is a struggle. Can you give some examples, just to get a flavour of who youre talking about ?

It's not so much about it not being preferable to be alive today than at any point in history (in most ways it obviously is), but more about it not being as perfect/glorious to be alive in this time of perceived medical and technological advancements as some think it is i.e. whilst some things have certainly improved, others are still as problematic as they always have been e.g. medical conditions that still have no cure or effective treatment.

In terms of the lottery, the odds used to be 1 in 14 million (they still are for 'set for life'), but they rejigged the format and it's now 1 in 45 million. However you get my point. If you factor in just one other condition I have I am effectively/statistically 1 in 7 billion people.

In terms of 'struggles' it depends who/what you're talking about. In terms of myself, without going into more detail that I should/would like to, just imagine removing almost everything from life that makes life pleasurable and worthwhile, whilst simultaneously having issues with virtually every area of a persons life that are necessary in order to survive, including the most very basic human functions.

[fagin]

Well in the manner of gratitude, thank you for this article. I read it in full and encountered a new word, convivial, though im not sure it is an apt use in contrast with industrial.

While theres a lot of discussion and claims in the article i cant but help feel there are 2 glaring errors, having tried to google in search of it as a joke journal to no avail (i still have my suspicions)
1 batman never said that re mispelling bateman
2 the thesis that there is a damage of colon via hygiene associated with the modern toilet seems incorrect.

Were people to use a toilet with greater focus on hygiene, then they would hover over the seat/bowl and squat supporting their own weight.
I'd argue that it is the hedonistic want of sharing a toilet seat and connecting buttcheeks via the toilet seat that led to the damage of colons and associated cancer not cited in the article. This is a matter of utilisation of the toilet rather than a requirement of using the device, the seat might be alluring but youd want to be a barbarian/daredevil to actually sit on it.

Having visited a sewerage treatment facility when i was quite young, id suggest that there is a misconception around the resource to waste issue. The facility screeds the resource and actually harvests most of the fecal matter. A mere small percentage diluted in water gets wasted as run off. Important knowledge for fishermen/women/pixiekins to know where these dumping points are.
Finally if you want to use shit as a manure, youd be far better off using cow shit than human shit.

I would also like to take a moment of personal privilige to raise the leave no trace concerns over bad pre-industrial forms of shitting.
For example in canada they have a lot of wilderness visitors in the winter. These people tend to need to take a shite on their trips. They typically just squat and dump. Then when the snow recedes and the flow of water occurs this accumulates in a flow of untreated 'resources' poisoning the water tables.
The correct method is to dig a trench about 6 inches deep into the soil. Take a shit, cover over shit and depart. The soil, bacteria, will get rid of it in a matter of days.

Hey there CC didn't realize you were so knowledgeable about how we tend to shit in this vast wilderness..lol !