Your team v Burnley

[Insidious]

.........................Alisson

Trent.....Matip.....Fabinho..Robertson

.......................Henderson

................Thiago.......Wijnaldum

...Salah...........Minamino..........Mane

[Kev0909]

. .Alisson

Neco.....Matip/Phillips.....Fabinho..Robertson

.......................Henderson/Wij

................Thiago.......Wijnaldum/Ox

...ShAq...........Origi..........Mane

time to try something different and go for it

[Nineteenx]

Bar Virgil's absence and Jota coming in to press for a place in the front 3 this would have been our best starting 11 for most games at the start of the season and we haven't been able to field it even once this season so far

So hopefully everyone can calm the fuck down, show a bit of faith and respect, stop reverting so quickly to doubters from believers in our first rocky patch in 3 seasons also accepting VAR have robbed us of 9 points and that's affected results and form and get behind this team, give it a run of 4 or 5 games and believe in it, expect the best and see what happens


Alisson

Trent Matip Fabinho Robertson

Thiago Henderson Wijnaldum

Salah Firmino Mane

My midfield 3 obviously rotating through the 3 positions throughout

[miller0863]

Thought Shaq deserves another start after today and Minamino can’t be any worse than Bobby, plus he did well last time out.

[boom-klopp]

firmino needs to be binned or we play a 4-2-4 like we did vs city.

we need something to happen because this is depressing to see.

we’re in a malaise and i can’t see where we get out of it.

burnley will be the nail in the coffin of our season.

[Insidious]

FAO Nineteenx - I debated writing a bit about why I am not picking Firmino for this match, but the post I just did in my Firmino thread (bearing in mind Burnley will "sit in" against us) probably covers it and I didn't want to take the thread on a huge tangent.

Miller - I quite liked what I saw from Shaq today too - thought he had a pretty good game besides getting booked a touch early, which isn't a huge dark mark against him at all.

I would want to use him as often as possible overall, but am also conscious that he is one of our "biscuits" players (Matip, Ox, Keita, Shaq) so am reluctant to play him more than once a week until we have Jota back.

[skyebo]

FAO Nineteenx - I debated writing a bit about why I am not picking Firmino for this match, but the post I just did in my Firmino thread (bearing in mind Burnley will "sit in" against us) probably covers it and I didn't want to take the thread on a huge tangent.

Miller - I quite liked what I saw from Shaq today too - thought he had a pretty good game besides getting booked a touch early, which isn't a huge dark mark against him at all.

I would want to use him as often as possible overall, but am also conscious that he is one of our "biscuits" players (Matip, Ox, Keita, Shaq) so am reluctant to play him more than once a week until we have Jota back.

Time to move all those injury prone players out the door, they are stealing a living, and Klopp should bring players in who he can rely on. Talent doesn't come into it when they spend more time in physio than they do on the pitch.

[LEGS]

Gini needs benching in this one Jones or Ox in.

Alisson
Trent
Robbo
Williams
Fabinho
Hendo
Thiago
Jones
Salah
Firmino
Mane

[Insidious]

Time to move all those injury prone players out the door, they are stealing a living, and Klopp should bring players in who he can rely on. Talent doesn't come into it when they spend more time in physio than they do on the pitch.

Pre-Covid I am sure we had our plans in place to move certain folks on whilst receiving money for them - Shaqiri and Origi undoubtedly will have been on that list - finding buyers for players will be trickier now though.

[skyebo]

Pre-Covid I am sure we had our plans in place to move certain folks on whilst receiving money for them - Shaqiri and Origi undoubtedly will have been on that list - finding buyers for players will be trickier now though.

We could find buyers, just have to accept that we won't get anywhere near what we paid to bring them here, especially Oxlade-Chamberlain and Keita, though wages could be a stumbling block too.

[Kev0909]

We could find buyers, just have to accept that we won't get anywhere near what we paid to bring them here, especially Oxlade-Chamberlain and Keita, though wages could be a stumbling block too.

With wij leaving and quite likely Milner

I don't see them going anywhere

we won't buy 5 players or so

will be lucky to get 3

[LEGS]

Keita and Ox wont be going anywhere.

With Brexit Ox is the safest one of the lot.

[skyebo]

With wij leaving and quite likely Milner

I don't see them going anywhere

we won't buy 5 players or so

will be lucky to get 3

That seems like a good idea, keep the crocks and let Wijnaldum leave in the summer.

[reddownunder]

Alisson
Trent Matip/Phillips Fabinho Robertson
Henderson Thiago Wijnaldum
Salah Firmino Mane

[Insidious]

We could find buyers, just have to accept that we won't get anywhere near what we paid to bring them here, especially Oxlade-Chamberlain and Keita, though wages could be a stumbling block too.

Wages, as you say.

A lot of Football clubs are financially crippled right now, or are, as I think the case is with us, "financially okay long-term, with short-term cash flow issues" - not many will want to invest in what isn't a safe bet, so Keita and Ox are here to stay.

Ironically enough, both have a shot from range and creative instincts - a sub appearance from Ox may be useful against Burnley.

[teesred]

Gini needs benching in this one Jones or Ox in.

Alisson
Trent
Robbo
Williams
Fabinho
Hendo
Thiago
Jones
Salah
Firmino
Mane

Agree about Gini.
Anyone else get the feeling he's "checked out"?

[teesred]

Keita and Ox wont be going anywhere.

With Brexit Ox is the safest one of the lot.

Unless someone at a German club has a momentary lapse of reason and decides to buy him (Keita). I can see someone taking him but we lose a packet. I'd rather we did if it meant we got someone who's fit for more than a week before breaking down. He's like a vintage car only not as good. Constant maintenance.

[Kev0909]

This is a must win for top4 forget the title

[justme]

I think TAA needs a rest.. I don't think mentally over come covid 19.. There does seem to something missing. I would play Shaqiri on the right and play Salah up the middle.Henderson/Wijnaldum and Jones in a 3.

[boom-klopp]

I think TAA needs a rest.. I don't think mentally over come covid 19.. There does seem to something missing. I would play Shaqiri on the right and play Salah up the middle.Henderson/Wijnaldum and Jones in a 3.

jones??? i wouldn’t even have him on the bench. he is total garbage, and does not belong at this level.

any player that takes that many touches before passing is still an u23 level/championship player at best.

we can play five in the middle, we’re not beating this lot.

wet cold night away at burnley in january, with salad and firmino up front, when you are in the worst form is a foregone conclusion.

[reddownunder]

jones??? i wouldn’t even have him on the bench. he is total garbage, and does not belong at this level.

any player that takes that many touches before passing is still an u23 level/championship player at best.

we can play five in the middle, we’re not beating this lot.

wet cold night away at burnley in january, with salad and firmino up front, when you are in the worst form is a foregone conclusion.

It's at Anfield though that doesn't make a lot of difference at the moment

[LEGS]

Agree about Gini.
Anyone else get the feeling he's "checked out"?

He wasnt good yesterday but to cut him some slack he has played pretty much every game this season.

At the start with CL and internationals he was playing 3 games a week for 2 months solid.

I think he will go as you say but what if Koeman gets sacked which is likely unless he wins the CL.

[teesred]

He wasnt good yesterday but to cut him some slack he has played pretty much every game this season.

At the start with CL and internationals he was playing 3 games a week for 2 months solid.

I think he will go as you say but what if Koeman gets sacked which is likely unless he wins the CL.

Yeah I'm probably just being mean by suggesting that.

[LEGS]

Yeah I'm probably just being mean by suggesting that.

I can see why you said it as he looked laboured.

[Steveo]

I think you might be surprised how laboured Hendo could look alongside Thiago. Have to remember it’s a totally different class of player. Kinda makes you realise what you are missing. That isn’t to say Thiago will be more effective in our system but technically when you see him on the ball and then Gini or Hendo you instantly realise the gulf in class. There was method behind playing Shaq - closer to Thiago level of quality. He needs to play with players on his level to thrive.

[Balinkay]

Yeah, Thiago is something else with the ball at his feet.

Though he let a man get behind him a few times. Fabinho wouldn't have. At worst he would have broken their collarbone. :D

Edit: I hope you're right regarding Shaq. I'm a big fan but his time is running out.

[jozza800]

I can see why you said it as he looked laboured.

They all have, for large parts of the season. I think Alison, Fab, Henderson, and Robbo aside you could throw a blanket of mediocrity over the rest (of those that arent or have not been injured).

But let's not freak out too much or throw the baby out with the dishwater. This team has been phenomonal for the best part of 3 years, we're not suddenly a bad team full of players that need replacing. We've been on nothing but an upward trajectory since Klopp took over, it's not going to be like that forever, there are going to be setbacks and failures.

It's a tricky situation. Does he play them into form, or try one or two others for a bit?

Burnley have no pace and love it long. So with that in mind i'd go with



Allison
TTA - Phillips - Fab - Robertson
Thiago - Henderson - Jones
Salah - Origi - Shaqiri

[Steveo]

Yeah, Thiago is something else with the ball at his feet.

Though he let a man get behind him a few times. Fabinho wouldn't have. At worst he would have broken their collarbone. :D

Edit: I hope you're right regarding Shaq. I'm a big fan but his time is running out.

For me you want Thiago with Fabinho in that midfield - then you can have any one of Hendo - Gini - Shaq - Ox or Keita...

We need a CB and we needed one in the summer- yet here we are in January-with our only 2 genuine senior CB’s out for the season ( cannot include Matip as a player - he just isn’t fit enough ) and we aren’t even looking for someone. Something is badly wrong at the club.

There are reasons why Klopp is an angry man - and they are not just because we can’t finish a hot dinner

[LEGS]

They all have, for large parts of the season. I think Alison, Fab, Henderson, and Robbo aside you could throw a blanket of mediocrity over the rest (of those that arent or have not been injured).

But let's not freak out too much or throw the baby out with the dishwater. This team has been phenomonal for the best part of 3 years, we're not suddenly a bad team full of players that need replacing. We've been on nothing but an upward trajectory since Klopp took over, it's not going to be like that forever, there are going to be setbacks and failures.

It's a tricky situation. Does he play them into form, or try one or two others for a bit?

Burnley have no pace and love it long. So with that in mind i'd go with




I agree he has basically had to play every minute in midfield.

With the season crammed in a shorter period our injuries have meant we have not had chance to rotate the midfield much.

Also lack of pre season means a drop off in performances/standards but as I keep stating this is not just us it is everyone.

I have watched all of our games and some other teams and most games are just not good at all.

[Balinkay]

For me you want Thiago with Fabinho in that midfield - then you can have any one of Hendo - Gini - Shaq - Ox or Keita...

We need a CB and we needed one in the summer- yet here we are in January-with our only 2 genuine senior CB’s out for the season ( cannot include Matip as a player - he just isn’t fit enough ) and we aren’t even looking for someone. Something is badly wrong at the club.

There are reasons why Klopp is an angry man - and they are not just because we can’t finish a hot dinner

Oooooo, I'm drooling over Thiago + Fabinho + Hendo.

[skyebo]

Oooooo, I'm drooling over Thiago + Fabinho + Hendo.

I think you'll have to wait till next season for that. Fabinho is needed at the back while we have injuries there. If we were buying a defender, i'm pretty sure it would have happened by now.

[LEGS]

Oooooo, I'm drooling over Thiago + Fabinho + Hendo.

It played once against Everton and it completely bossed em.

[Nineteenx]

For me you want Thiago with Fabinho in that midfield - then you can have any one of Hendo - Gini - Shaq - Ox or Keita...

We need a CB and we needed one in the summer- yet here we are in January-with our only 2 genuine senior CB’s out for the season ( cannot include Matip as a player - he just isn’t fit enough ) and we aren’t even looking for someone. Something is badly wrong at the club.

There are reasons why Klopp is an angry man - and they are not just because we can’t finish a hot dinner

Fabinho's secured his place as our third choice cb for me

I don't expect to see him in midfield even when we're back to full strength

The fundamental reason being that he can't play as part of a fluid 3, he can only play DM and he struggles when required to play as an actual CM rather than an out and out DM, let's the press get broken and allows too many easy transitions

Teams will try to target Thiago with 1 or 2 players, so for me the midfield 3 moving forward has to be the fluid midfield 3 in which all 3 interchange positions throughout and all 3 are comfortable assuming the No6 position and have the discipline, awareness and focus to stay with the opposition player for transitions

Much maligned as he remarkably still is, Gini too in fact, that pair have best supported our full backs AND any of Lallana Ox Keita or Milner playing in a fluid 3 and whoever the third player was of those listed, that 3 performing better than any midfield with Fabinho in it, the rotation through all 3 positions played a big part in that because opposition managers are unable to set up for certain players to close down or play off a specific player because their position changes fluently and frequently throughout each game

[LEGS]

Fabinho has done a great job at CB and its good to know he can play there.

I want two new CBs in the summer as we have to be careful with Gomez/VVD next season.

We could do with loaning out Rhys Williams to someone like Preston or Bristol City.

Fabinho is needed in midfield in some games being fluid is always good but sometimes you need to grind a team down and Fab doesnt get bullied either in midfield.

[skyebo]

Fabinho's secured his place as our third choice cb for me

I don't expect to see him in midfield even when we're back to full strength

The fundamental reason being that he can't play as part of a fluid 3, he can only play DM and he struggles when required to play as an actual CM rather than an out and out DM, let's the press get broken and allows too many easy transitions

Teams will try to target Thiago with 1 or 2 players, so for me the midfield 3 moving forward has to be the fluid midfield 3 in which all 3 interchange positions throughout and all 3 are comfortable assuming the No6 position and have the discipline, awareness and focus to stay with the opposition player for transitions

Much maligned as he remarkably still is, Gini too in fact, that pair have best supported our full backs AND any of Lallana Ox Keita or Milner playing in a fluid 3 and whoever the third player was of those listed, that 3 performing better than any midfield with Fabinho in it, the rotation through all 3 positions played a big part in that because opposition managers are unable to set up for certain players to close down or play off a specific player because their position changes fluently and frequently throughout each game

Where was the press in the games against Fulham WBA Newcastle and Southampton. We dropped points in all those games and Fabinho played centre back and Henderson was CM. If Henderson is so good at pressing, he should consider retiring from football and get a job at Johnson's.

[justme]

Oooooo, I'm drooling over Thiago + Fabinho + Hendo.
Not many goals in there if any

[Kev0909]

Not many goals in there if any

Same with any midfield we can put out tbh at least fabinho can score the odd screamer

we basically count on salah and mane for all the goals... proper striker is needed really if we don't have a stevie G not many out there like that now though

[boom-klopp]

It played once against Everton and it completely bossed em.

in an ideal world, if we had a cb with matip fit all season, that middle 3 of fab, thiago and hendo would win us the title and european cup.

it’s that good. we got a taste of it in the derby, and it was frightening. i’ve never seen a midfield nick the ball off the opposition that quickly.

i just wish we get to see it this season.

[Balinkay]

Not many goals in there if any

True, but a lot of ball winning and passing scrumptiousness. If you give the attack enough chances, they'll score.


in an ideal world, if we had a cb with matip fit all season, that middle 3 of fab, thiago and hendo would win us the title and european cup.

it’s that good. we got a taste of it in the derby, and it was frightening. i’ve never seen a midfield nick the ball off the opposition that quickly.

i just wish we get to see it this season.

For once we agree!

[RedNoodle]

"If you give the attack enough chances, they'll score."

Err Bali mate, have you been watching our recent games with a blindfold on? :cool:

[Steveo]

"If you give the attack enough chances, they'll score."

Err Bali mate, have you been watching our recent games with a blindfold on? :cool:

There have been chances to score Noods BUT we haven’t been really been creating them and they haven’t been clear cut for me . That’s the point. We were never prolific even at our best - usually needed 4 or 5 good chances to get a couple of goals. Right now we aren’t creating any really good chances really.

Best actual chance we created v the filth was from Shaq’s sublime pass to Salah who lays it on for Bobby - it was a decent chance to score and he should have nailed it but it was really the only clear cut one I can think of. United had 2 and didn’t score either.

This is the problem in not having a proper number 9. You have to have at least one goal poacher in your squad. Relentlessly playing Bobby in the same role EVEN last season - as often as not - it failed to work.

Make no mistake we won the title last season despite Bobby doing relatively little. He is the perfect player for the big games - perfect against a City or a Bayern or any side that wants to play - against a side that has to win... but playing sides that are happy to sit and block..? It is madness.

Many are scratching their heads BUT much of our success has been dependent on Virgil - his presence AND his crucial goals - without him - and Alisson - and playing Klopp’s preferred front 3 - we win nothing. We would be the side that Coutinho left minus Coutinho..! Capable of winning 5:0 and getting beat 4:1... A great watch but a yo-yo side.

Did the club fail to spot this? Do they care enough to bother? It was. CLEAR as Crystal to me after that fortunate CL final win in 2019 that we were crying out for more. More in the middle - more up top and more at the back. But we did ZERO. This summer was then a slightly desperate attempt to paper over the issues. Bring in that guaranteed quality to midfield - Thiago - but getting on a bit in years - and not the best fitness record... Also Jota - both great buys but for me - too little too late.

No real surprise that the once brilliant source of goals which regularly got us out of jail - Salah and Mané - have also gone off the boil - there has simply been too much dependence - an over reliance on the same players for too long a period with nothing else to support it.

And here we are - 2 key injuries - and it is really just the 2 - Matip will play more this season than last. And we are a shadow of the side.

[Balinkay]

"If you give the attack enough chances, they'll score."

Err Bali mate, have you been watching our recent games with a blindfold on? :cool:

No. I've actually been paying attention. In only one game (I guess WBA) did we miss a bagful of good chances. In the other ones we just didn't create enough (modulo bs VAR decisions).

Edit: Errr, why do I even bother posting anymore? Steveo just says what I'm thinking. :D

[RedNoodle]

No. I've actually been paying attention. In only one game (I guess WBA) did we miss a bagful of good chances. In the other ones we just didn't create enough (modulo bs VAR decisions).

Edit: Errr, why do I even bother posting anymore? Steveo just says what I'm thinking. :D

One person's 'half chance' is another person's 'good chance', which in turn is someone else's 'sitter'. Our midfield could/should be creating more chances, as well as scoring more goals themselves, but our front three aren't helping themselves by not getting shots on target, miscontroling the ball, taking too long to get shots away, hitting 'powderpuff' shots etc.

In my opinion we've had more than enough 'chances' or 'opportunities' to have won all the games we've recently dropped points in. Many people expected our defence to be the thing that could/would end up costing us dear, but it's the other end of the pitch that has been the biggest issue as of late.

[skyebo]

One person's 'half chance' is another person's 'good chance', which in turn is someone else's 'sitter'. Our midfield could/should be creating more chances, as well as scoring more goals themselves, but our front three aren't helping themselves by not getting shots on target, miscontroling the ball, taking too long to get shots away, hitting 'powderpuff' shots etc.

In my opinion we've had more than enough 'chances' or 'opportunities' to have won all the games we've recently dropped points in. Many people expected our defence to be the thing that could/would end up costing us dear, but it's the other end of the pitch that has been the biggest issue as of late.

It's at the other end where we are missing VVD, a real threat at set pieces and corners.

[Balinkay]

One person's 'half chance' is another person's 'good chance', which in turn is someone else's 'sitter'. Our midfield could/should be creating more chances, as well as scoring more goals themselves, but our front three aren't helping themselves by not getting shots on target, miscontroling the ball, taking too long to get shots away, hitting 'powderpuff' shots etc.

In my opinion we've had more than enough 'chances' or 'opportunities' to have won all the games we've recently dropped points in. Many people expected our defence to be the thing that could/would end up costing us dear, but it's the other end of the pitch that has been the biggest issue as of late.

We can try to take a look at a slightly more objective (if rather flawed) measure - xG. I can't look at the stats right now, but iirc our values for the aforementioned games weren't that good. Can you please check and post them? I can only take a look after work.

[LEGS]

One person's 'half chance' is another person's 'good chance', which in turn is someone else's 'sitter'. Our midfield could/should be creating more chances, as well as scoring more goals themselves, but our front three aren't helping themselves by not getting shots on target, miscontroling the ball, taking too long to get shots away, hitting 'powderpuff' shots etc.

In my opinion we've had more than enough 'chances' or 'opportunities' to have won all the games we've recently dropped points in. Many people expected our defence to be the thing that could/would end up costing us dear, but it's the other end of the pitch that has been the biggest issue as of late.

It is our defence that is costing us if Van Djik was back fully fit tomorrow id fancy us strongly.

His leadership, pace and threat from set pieces are worth an extra 8-10 points over the season.

Its clear our full backs are not attacking as much as they used to I dont need stats I just use my eyes.

Our midfield is workman like our flair players Thiago Shaq Ox Keita have all been out injured with Fab stuck at the back.

I do accept we could do with Jota now to keep the forwards fresh but that one is on Klopp.

Minamino or Origi may start Thursday who knows.

We are defo not as confident as we have been over the last few years it means we play more safe not passing as sharply which Thiago if fit will change.

[Insidious]

If we look at the big picture of a League campaign, I always divide seasons into blocks, with the 25-game mark being the point you look from and go "okay, final stretch, foot down, into rhythm with European games, others will fall away".

Our job essentially in normal circumstances is to find ourselves either out in front at that stage, or within touching distance.

Given we're having a wobble, the key thing to me is to be keeping clean sheets where we can. You keep a clean sheet, your spluttering attacking unit needs one goal, not three or four, to win a match.

I think we'll see an attempt to keep consistency in the back four, with the emphasis on the possession game maintained as well, possibly grinding some results. Klopp may surprise some and decide it is Henderson beside Fabinho for a bit (even with Matip fit) just to keep the chemistry and have that passing option from deep that we miss with Van Dijk, but we'll see.

I'd take a ground out 1-0 against Burnley all day long, just to keep us within 4 points (assuming City win their game in hand) of top spot. Having Burnley, then United, then Spurs won't be pleasant, but having three matches in a row against low blocks will probably help us get a little bit closer to finding solutions.

I think short-term it's going to be unpleasant for a while longer, but we'll see the results further down the line.

[Balinkay]

xG values:

LFC 1.69 - 0.74 WBA
NUFC 0.79 - 1.47 LFC
Saints 0.33 - 1.77 LFC
FFC 1.50 - 1.87 LFC

BFC 2.22 - 0.32 LFC

Contrast this with some chosen games earlier in the season:

LFC 4.35 - 1.65 LCFC
LFC 2.76 - 1.69 SHU

[ianlfc]

Something needs to change up front, wether its personnel or formation but it's just not clicking at the moment.

[Nineteenx]

Where was the press in the games against Fulham WBA Newcastle and Southampton. We dropped points in all those games and Fabinho played centre back and Henderson was CM. If Henderson is so good at pressing, he should consider retiring from football and get a job at Johnson's.

If you want to argue a point, it's usually best to argue against the actual point made and also demonstrate you do pay close attention to the finer points of our play and the games, having Hendo playing in midfield v Southampton when he played at CB obviously doesn't reflect well on you in that respect, nor does there not being any issues with our press v Newcastle or WBA and a combination of wasteful finishing, poor execution of the final ball and poor or rather bias officiating being the reason for the draws in those 2

From when that fluid midfield 3 emerged last season i have maintained that our best midfield 3 should be fluid and include Hendo AND Gini plus one other who can operate in that 3 and facilitate the fluidity and be good in the press, Jones is not such a player yet and he was particularly abysmal v Fulham

It has worked at its highest levels with Hendo Gini and Keita and resulted in all the latters best games for us, Thiago is a considerable step up from Naby with the same but more developed skills sets, so logically Thiago with Hendo and Gini should be an improvement on the best previous midfield since Jurgen arrived

[Nineteenx]

One person's 'half chance' is another person's 'good chance', which in turn is someone else's 'sitter'. Our midfield could/should be creating more chances, as well as scoring more goals themselves, but our front three aren't helping themselves by not getting shots on target, miscontroling the ball, taking too long to get shots away, hitting 'powderpuff' shots etc.

In my opinion we've had more than enough 'chances' or 'opportunities' to have won all the games we've recently dropped points in. Many people expected our defence to be the thing that could/would end up costing us dear, but it's the other end of the pitch that has been the biggest issue as of late.

All forwards miss chances all the fucking time

Also really time you started to accept that our midfielders getting into more forward positions more frequently to hav the same amount of opportunity to do the things other club's midfielders you drool over do doesn't and won't happen because Jurgen has consistently used them deeper and more defensively as a platform to support our 3 forwards and 2 full backs playing as high as they have

He's been doing that for 4 seasons now, one might have thought the chasm of difference between how our mids are used and what their role is compared to that of almost all other clubs might have sunk in by now

[skyebo]

If you want to argue a point, it's usually best to argue against the actual point made and also demonstrate you do pay close attention to the finer points of our play and the games, having Hendo playing in midfield v Southampton when he played at CB obviously doesn't reflect well on you in that respect, nor does there not being any issues with our press v Newcastle or WBA and a combination of wasteful finishing, poor execution of the final ball and poor or rather bias officiating being the reason for the draws in those 2

From when that fluid midfield 3 emerged last season i have maintained that our best midfield 3 should be fluid and include Hendo AND Gini plus one other who can operate in that 3 and facilitate the fluidity and be good in the press, Jones is not such a player yet and he was particularly abysmal v Fulham

It has worked at its highest levels with Hendo Gini and Keita and resulted in all the latters best games for us, Thiago is a considerable step up from Naby with the same but more developed skills sets, so logically Thiago with Hendo and Gini should be an improvement on the best previous midfield since Jurgen arrived

I got it wrong where Henderson played at Southampton, but in the other games he was employed in the position where Fabinho would have played but for injuries at the back. You can't put all the blame on Fabinho when the press breaks down, there are 3 players in midfield not just one. My point was Henderson was part of the 3 in those games when Fabinho was centre back. So the press wasn't working then either, unless you just want to blame the front 3 for dropping points.

[Nineteenx]

I got it wrong where Henderson played at Southampton, but in the other games he was employed in the position where Fabinho would have played but for injuries at the back. You can't put all the blame on Fabinho when the press breaks down, there are 3 players in midfield not just one. My point was Henderson was part of the 3 in those games when Fabinho was centre back. So the press wasn't working then either, unless you just want to blame the front 3 for dropping points.

The press was absolute fine v WBA and Newcastle, both had one chance from a set piece, or recycled ball from a poor clearance from one, when i talk about Fabinho letting the press and counter press be broken easily it is always from him leaving the opposition player for transition, go and watch the short highlights from our best midfield performance this season v Palace and since before Fabinho was undeservedly brought back in last season, no surprises the midfield 3 were Hendo Gini and Keita.

Pay particular attention to the position of all 3 on 3 or 4 of our goals, in the No6 position, very clearly focused on staying with the opposition player for transition should our play break down, you can see it with crystal clarity, unless you either don't want to or never noticed or understood our press and counter press at the highest levels since Jurgen arrived and the importance of the personnel and that 3 interchanging between all 3 positions, which in your case, is probably a mixture of both

[skyebo]

The press was absolute fine v WBA and Newcastle, both had one chance from a set piece, or recycled ball from a poor clearance from one, when i talk about Fabinho letting the press and counter press be broken easily it is always from him leaving the opposition player for transition, go and watch the short highlights from our best midfield performance this season v Palace and since before Fabinho was undeservedly brought back in last season, no surprises the midfield 3 were Hendo Gini and Keita.

Pay particular attention to the position of all 3 on 3 or 4 of our goals, in the No6 position, very clearly focused on staying with the opposition player for transition should our play break down, you can see it with crystal clarity, unless you either don't want to or never noticed or understood our press and counter press at the highest levels since Jurgen arrived and the importance of the personnel and that 3 interchanging between all 3 positions, which in your case, is probably a mixture of both

I understand the game perfectly well. Most people on here recognise the importance of Fabinho in the team whether it's in the middle or at the back. You clearly don't because of all the negative comments you put on about him. I will praise anyone who plays well, though you were the same when Joe Allen dared to take Lucas's place in games or come on for him, so i'm not totally surprised at your bias. You say there was nothing wrong with the press in those games. I bet there would have been if Fabinho was playing there and who would be getting the stick.

[RedNoodle]

All forwards miss chances all the fucking time

Also really time you started to accept that our midfielders getting into more forward positions more frequently to hav the same amount of opportunity to do the things other club's midfielders you drool over do doesn't and won't happen because Jurgen has consistently used them deeper and more defensively as a platform to support our 3 forwards and 2 full backs playing as high as they have

He's been doing that for 4 seasons now, one might have thought the chasm of difference between how our mids are used and what their role is compared to that of almost all other clubs might have sunk in by now

Not ALL forwards miss ALL their chances ALL the time. When they do start missing it's usually not a teams entire forward line. Most, if not all forwards go through periods (some longer than others) where things aren't quite coming off for them, but what happens in those instances, or at least should when it comes to any 'big' club is that either a few 'decent' alternatives are available (we had just one, and we all know why we only had one, and who is responsible for his absence), and/or other players/areas of the pitch take up some of the slack and chip in with some goals and creativity. As it stands our entire forward line is off form, and not only do we not have any decent alternatives, but no other player/area is picking up the slack.

I know the way Klopp plays, but that doesn't mean it is always the right way to play, or that it cannot be altered slightly to give us a bit more of whatever it is that we happen be lacking. Klopp's way of playing also means that you need a large, fit squad, and a quality one at that. Currently we have a weak squad that is full of injured players, meaning that unless the bulk of our squad remains fit, and virtually all of our first XI stay injury free, we are always playing on a knife edge. It happened at Dortmund, and the current situation with us isn't looking too dissimilar.

You talk as if no player has ever existed who has the ability to provide both some solidity in midfield, but can also add a bit of creativity and a few goals. Even if there wasn't such players, you should still have others available to you who can come into the team and make a positive difference as and when a change of approach needs to be made, not that Klopp would necessarily make any changes until very late in the game.

[Nineteenx]

He brought Thiago in for the extra creativity, hardly his fault Oliver and the VAR twats didn't send Prickford off and tried to let the bitters kick us off the park to the combined effect that Richarlieson was emboldened to lamp Thiago

Hopefully we'll get rid of a few stealing a living in the summer and add Fabian Ruiz, another like Thiago who is absolute quality, would fit right into how we play add more creativity and quality with the ball and who'd add more goals and assists

[justme]

Maddison would be an excellent signing.. Along with Haaland

[Nineteenx]

I understand the game perfectly well. Most people on here recognise the importance of Fabinho in the team whether it's in the middle or at the back. You clearly don't because of all the negative comments you put on about him. I will praise anyone who plays well, though you were the same when Joe Allen dared to take Lucas's place in games or come on for him, so i'm not totally surprised at your bias. You say there was nothing wrong with the press in those games. I bet there would have been if Fabinho was playing there and who would be getting the stick.

I'm all about the team, always have been, 'the team' evolved, played at the highest levels it ever has both performance and results wise in his absence and it was wrong to bring him back in when Klopp did, i think Fab's been brilliant at CB and 'was' very good as an out and out DM when the team played with a fixed deeply lying DM, since the evolution of our play the DM role, as it was when Fab played it no lnger exists, it's a CM role and Fab isn't a CM

Jurgen bought Thiago and didn't replace Lovren for that reason imo, Fab was our Lovren replacement and Thiago and Hendo replaced Fab in midfield because the role e was bought to play became defunkt and he isn't a CM

[skyebo]

I'm all about the team, always have been, 'the team' evolved, played at the highest levels it ever has both performance and results wise in his absence and it was wrong to bring him back in when Klopp did, i think Fab's been brilliant at CB and 'was' very good as an out and out DM when the team played with a fixed deeply lying DM, since the evolution of our play the DM role, as it was when Fab played it no lnger exists, it's a CM role and Fab isn't a CM

Jurgen bought Thiago and didn't replace Lovren for that reason imo, Fab was our Lovren replacement and Thiago and Hendo replaced Fab in midfield because the role e was bought to play became defunkt and he isn't a CM

How can Fabinho be Lovren's replacement? Lovren wasn't getting games and was only 4th choice. Fabinho plays every week. Time will tell who gets their places when they are all fit.

[Nineteenx]

How can Fabinho be Lovren's replacement? Lovren wasn't getting games and was only 4th choice. Fabinho plays every week. Time will tell who gets their places when they are all fit.

Time will tell, but Thiago i a CM, so putting your 'Hendo took the armband after Stevie' bias to ne side and takking captain fantastic out of the equation for a minte

Is Thiago a far superior CM to Fabinho?

Will teams try to smother him to prevent him creating?

As Thiago can create from anywhere but will mostly start at CM will he be of the greatest possible benefit to the team playing in a fluid midfield 3 interchanging positions throughout whereby it's almost impossible for opposition managers to detail 1 or 2 players to stop him creating because he's not playing in a fixed position?

Given Thiago is a vastly superior CM to Fab, who pertinently isn't a CM, but is a very good DM, AND that we can't play a fluid midfield 3 with Fab and never have and other midfielders who can play the fluid 3 all offer more creatively and in the press and counter press than Fab, do you honestly expect Fab to start at CM ahead of Thiago in what would be a rigid 3 in fixed positions?

I don't, i think Fab's role this season was going to be largely from the bench or in cup games, coming on for the last 20 minutes in games we were comfortably ahead in as an extra defender or midfielder or to give Trent 20 minutes rest with Gomez moving to RB or one of our first choice mids 20 minutes rest

[skyebo]

Time will tell, but Thiago i a CM, so putting your 'Hendo took the armband after Stevie' bias to ne side and takking captain fantastic out of the equation for a minte

Is Thiago a far superior CM to Fabinho?

Will teams try to smother him to prevent him creating?

As Thiago can create from anywhere but will mostly start at CM will he be of the greatest possible benefit to the team playing in a fluid midfield 3 interchanging positions throughout whereby it's almost impossible for opposition managers to detail 1 or 2 players to stop him creating because he's not playing in a fixed position?

Given Thiago is a vastly superior CM to Fab, who pertinently isn't a CM, but is a very good DM, AND that we can't play a fluid midfield 3 with Fab and never have and other midfielders who can play the fluid 3 all offer more creatively and in the press and counter press than Fab, do you honestly expect Fab to start at CM ahead of Thiago in what would be a rigid 3 in fixed positions?

I don't, i think Fab's role this season was going to be largely from the bench or in cup games, coming on for the last 20 minutes in games we were comfortably ahead in as an extra defender or midfielder or to give Trent 20 minutes rest with Gomez moving to RB or one of our first choice mids 20 minutes rest

You need to get something right about the captaincy. A lot of people were slating Henderson both as player and as captain after taking over from Gerrard, even questioning his place in the team. I was NOT one of those, as i said he was the obvious choice, and whoever gets the captaincy next won't get a rough ride as he won't be replacing a legend. I don't need to go back 100s of posts, as i know what i said. And don't be so cock sure that it won't be Henderson who loses his place, he may decide to bring someone else in. Or Fulham may want him again lol

[skyebo]

Time will tell, but Thiago i a CM, so putting your 'Hendo took the armband after Stevie' bias to ne side and takking captain fantastic out of the equation for a minte

Is Thiago a far superior CM to Fabinho?

Will teams try to smother him to prevent him creating?

As Thiago can create from anywhere but will mostly start at CM will he be of the greatest possible benefit to the team playing in a fluid midfield 3 interchanging positions throughout whereby it's almost impossible for opposition managers to detail 1 or 2 players to stop him creating because he's not playing in a fixed position?

Given Thiago is a vastly superior CM to Fab, who pertinently isn't a CM, but is a very good DM, AND that we can't play a fluid midfield 3 with Fab and never have and other midfielders who can play the fluid 3 all offer more creatively and in the press and counter press than Fab, do you honestly expect Fab to start at CM ahead of Thiago in what would be a rigid 3 in fixed positions?

I don't, i think Fab's role this season was going to be largely from the bench or in cup games, coming on for the last 20 minutes in games we were comfortably ahead in as an extra defender or midfielder or to give Trent 20 minutes rest with Gomez moving to RB or one of our first choice mids 20 minutes rest

Your last paragraph is laughable.

[Nineteenx]

Time will tell, but Thiago i a CM, so putting your 'Hendo took the armband after Stevie' bias to ne side and takking captain fantastic out of the equation for a minte

Is Thiago a far superior CM to Fabinho?

Will teams try to smother him to prevent him creating?

As Thiago can create from anywhere but will mostly start at CM will he be of the greatest possible benefit to the team playing in a fluid midfield 3 interchanging positions throughout whereby it's almost impossible for opposition managers to detail 1 or 2 players to stop him creating because he's not playing in a fixed position?

Given Thiago is a vastly superior CM to Fab, who pertinently isn't a CM, but is a very good DM, AND that we can't play a fluid midfield 3 with Fab and never have and other midfielders who can play the fluid 3 all offer more creatively and in the press and counter press than Fab, do you honestly expect Fab to start at CM ahead of Thiago in what would be a rigid 3 in fixed positions?

I don't, i think Fab's role this season was going to be largely from the bench or in cup games, coming on for the last 20 minutes in games we were comfortably ahead in as an extra defender or midfielder or to give Trent 20 minutes rest with Gomez moving to RB or one of our first choice mids 20 minutes rest

That's it for me, a huge part of Jurgen's philosophy that has made us so successful is centred around the press and counter press, nothing against Fab, but you can't do that to its highest levels in a rigid 3, you only need to look at the rotation of the 3 in our run of 15 back to back wins in Fab's absence and their starting positions and the positions all 3 are in and their contribution from where they were to what were absolutely crucial winning goals against Spurs and Wolves for Bobby among many others to appreciate that

[Nineteenx]

Your last paragraph is laughable.

You lot are laughable, despite the constant knocking of my belief on this issue and numerous invitations from me to answer a straight forward question on the subject, not one of you has or can

If Fab was so brilliant at DM a DM supposed to be playing right across the line covering the defence, why, half way through his first season, did we start drawing too many games through teams releasing players down our right?

Why was it ever necessary for Jurgen to bring Hendo in at RCM to stop this, when the DM 's role is to stop it?

Why in his absence with Milner, Ox, Keita and even fucking Lallana starting at RCM in a fluid 3, every single one of them assuming the No6 position at various points in those games was it never an issue?

[skyebo]

You lot are laughable, despite the constant knocking of my belief on this issue and numerous invitations from me to answer a straight forward question on the subject, not one of you has or can

If Fab was so brilliant at DM a DM supposed to be playing right across the line covering the defence, why, half way through his first season, did we start drawing too many games through teams releasing players down our right?

Why was it ever necessary for Jurgen to bring Hendo in at RCM to stop this, when the DM 's role is to stop it?

Why in his absence with Milner, Ox, Keita and even fucking Lallana starting at RCM in a fluid 3, every single one of them assuming the No6 position at various points in those games was it never an issue?

He must have done a lot of thing right. He was ranked #1 LFC in 2020 calendar year for most tackles and interceptions. He played a lot of those games in midfield, though you said you wasn't interested in Fabinho's stats when i posted them last time. That's not opinion, those stats are fact.

[Nineteenx]

He must have done a lot of thing right. He was ranked #1 LFC in 2020 calendar year for most tackles and interceptions. He played a lot of those games in midfield, though you said you wasn't interested in Fabinho's stats when i posted them last time. That's not opinion, those stats are fact.

Not an answer to my question

Let me define my understanding of the DM role at any level of the game and you tell me if you disagree or where i'm wrong

The DM's role is to play right across the width of the pitch,,constantly scanning looking for any danger as play develops and positioning himself accordingly

He must stay with any central player for transition, but as play develops if it is clear the ball is not going to that player but is going wide behind a full back, he ust move across to prevent that threat, knowing the planned player for transition he was picking up will now be engaged by eith of the 2 CBS

Defending deeper wen a team has good possession wide h mmust support the defence by being in a good position to go behind the defensive line to challenge late runners not engaged by any other player or to block and clear attempted balls into the box from wide advanced opposition players

That's the basics of the primary job, it's why the position is called defensive midfielder and if you're doing that job as you should be, you shouldn't need your manager to bring in another player to do any part of it for you

[skyebo]

Not an answer to my question

Let me define my understanding of the DM role at any level of the game and you tell me if you disagree or where i'm wrong

The DM's role is to play right across the width of the pitch,,constantly scanning looking for any danger as play develops and positioning himself accordingly

He must stay with any central player for transition, but as play develops if it is clear the ball is not going to that player but is going wide behind a full back, he ust move across to prevent that threat, knowing the planned player for transition he was picking up will now be engaged by eith of the 2 CBS

Defending deeper wen a team has good possession wide h mmust support the defence by being in a good position to go behind the defensive line to challenge late runners not engaged by any other player or to block and clear attempted balls into the box from wide advanced opposition players

That's the basics of the primary job, it's why the position is called defensive midfielder and if you're doing that job as you should be, you shouldn't need your manager to bring in another player to do any part of it for you

If you mean is Thiago superior to Fabinho, it's too early to call. Up to now he hasn't scored or had an assist, but hopefully that will change. It's ok coming with a reputation, but Keita came with glowing references too. The proof will be in the pudding.

[Nineteenx]

You need to get something right about the captaincy.

I already did, i backed him unequivocally and a Champions League WCC ESC and Premier League trophy later, i was right and he was instrumental in all of that

There have been 2 clear huge shifts in our performance levels and ability to win those trophies in the last 2 years. Hendo coming on at ht in that game away t Southampton and Hendo coming in at CM last season

[skyebo]

I already did, i backed him unequivocally and a Champions League WCC ESC and Premier League trophy later, i was right and he was instrumental in all of that

There have been 2 clear huge shifts in our performance levels and ability to win those trophies in the last 2 years. Hendo coming on at ht in that game away t Southampton and Hendo coming in at CM last season

Without VVD and Alisson we wouldn't have won either of those, they are the ones we need to thank. All others played their part too. Take your Henderson glasses off, you might see things a lot clearer. And speaking of game changers, you need look no further than Gerrard for that, he did that countless times over the years. He didn't win the league, but he deserved to. Henderson is playing in a better team than most that Gerrard played in, so is getting a lot of help. Some of the players Gerrard had to play with shouldn't have got near the team. If Henderson played till he was 50, he could never influence or change games like Gerrard could, that's why he's a legend.

[jr81]

Alisson

Trent
Matip
Fabinho
Robertson
Ox
Thiago
Wijnaldum
Shaq
Origi
Mane

No Henderson in the squad

[Insidious]

Oh wow, that is not what I expected!

[miller0863]

Liverpool Team

1 Alisson

66 Alexander-Arnold
32 Matip
3 Fabinho
26 Robertson

15 Oxlade-Chamberlain
6 Thiago Alcántara
5 Wijnaldum

23 Shaqiri
10 Mané
27 Origi


Substitutes
7 Milner
9 Firmino
11 Salah
17 Jones
18 Minamino
21 Tsimikas
47 Phillips
62 Kelleher
76 N Williams

[Nineteenx]

Team confirmed:


Alisson

Trent Matip Fabinho Robertson

Shaqiri Thiago Wijnaldum

Oxlade Origi Mane

Well, fuck knows how we're lining up, might be a 4231, let's just hope it works, Jurgen's already played our forwards out of their great early season form fucking about with their positions, so I won't be particularly enamoured if Mane's lining up as a left attacking midfielder in a 4231, or Origi's lining up as LFWD as he's been consistently shit when used there

[jr81]

Team confirmed:


Alisson

Trent Matip Fabinho Robertson

Shaqiri Thiago Wijnaldum

Oxlade Origi Mane

Well, fuck knows how we're lining up, might be a 4231, let's just hope it works, Jurgen's already played our forwards out of their great early season form fucking about with their positions, so I won't be particularly enamoured if Mane's lining up as a left attacking midfielder in a 4231, or Origi's lining up as LFWD as he's been consistently shit when used there

Agreed on origi. He has been terrible when deployed on the left forward.
He needs to play through the middle.
Big shock and risk. We really need a win.

[RedNoodle]

How many unfit, constantly injured, inconsistent, out of form, out of position, sub par players would you like in your side (the reigning PL champs) who desperately need a win?

Klopp: Yes.

[HLOGI]

Liverpool Team

1 Alisson

66 Alexander-Arnold
32 Matip
3 Fabinho
26 Robertson

15 Oxlade-Chamberlain
6 Thiago Alcántara
5 Wijnaldum

23 Shaqiri
10 Mané
27 Origi


Substitutes
7 Milner
9 Firmino
11 Salah
17 Jones
18 Minamino
21 Tsimikas
47 Phillips
62 Kelleher
76 N Williams


Klopp is focussing on the FA Cup lol.

But dropping Salah may have the desired effect. Just a little tonic to inspire him.

Bobby well deserved, he has been atrocious. Perhaps he is tired if we can win rest jim again and let him have that time off. Maybe it is just fatigue. I mean I. terms of Jo's overall play. His goalscoring ability has never been great.

[Nineteenx]

At least we've got Thiago and Wijnaldum in midfield and our best possible back 5 starting is the best I can say, really REALLY hope he's not fucking about with Mane's position again, it's been driving me absolutely crazy this season,

The UAE FC game was the worst for me, moving him to left mid in a 442 when he'd won the penalty and looked like destroying their new big money CB and keeping Jota up top instead when A he doesn't have the same skills set as Mane that were the skills that were terrorising their CB B He played LFWD almost all games at Wolves and due to how they play spent a large portion of each game playing in the left mid position. It was just absolute insanity to me, clueless

[Insidious]

Klopp is focussing on the FA Cup lol.

Tongue-in-cheek, but we may well have looked at City's recent resurgence in combination with our own issues and decided the Title will be difficult, so the priority has reshuffled to focus on the Champion's League and FA Cup.

It would surprise me of course - half a season left after tonight - but we won't know know until there is a bigger sample size of team line-ups.

Origi over Minamino feels a bit "shop window" to me. That said, he is a decent physical unit and we can expect set pieces.

[redebreck]

Team confirmed:


Alisson

Trent Matip Fabinho Robertson

Shaqiri Thiago Wijnaldum

Oxlade Origi Mane

Well, fuck knows how we're lining up, might be a 4231, let's just hope it works, Jurgen's already played our forwards out of their great early season form fucking about with their positions, so I won't be particularly enamoured if Mane's lining up as a left attacking midfielder in a 4231, or Origi's lining up as LFWD as he's been consistently shit when used there

Booked my seat behind the setteeeeeeeeeeeeeeee.
Just in case.

[faridtoxteth]

Seeing as how Burnley's only tactic for playing football is win a set piece, hoof the ball under the crossbar and pile in on the keeper, I would suggest that this is the best option for a player like Origi who can add defensive headers to his offensive ariel ability.
Been disappointed with Ox recent games. Please step up tonight.
Quite happy to see Shaq getting a few games actually.

[Artisan]

Kind of agree giving Salah and Bobby a chance to sit back and muster...Hopefully Origi and Thiago's link up play has been phenomenal in training. Let's do this...

[skyebo]

They got a draw in this fixture last season, and we had a stronger team than tonight's. Though the title was already won by then. It's a good job Mane is out there, can't see anyone else scoring, they are welcome to prove me wrong.

[Nineteenx]

Seeing as how Burnley's only tactic for playing football is win a set piece, hoof the ball under the crossbar and pile in on the keeper, I would suggest that this is the best option for a player like Origi who can add defensive headers to his offensive ariel ability.
Been disappointed with Ox recent games. Please step up tonight.
Quite happy to see Shaq getting a few games actually.

When as he ever demonstrated any of these things? He's absolutely useless in the fucking air, when he's been consistently absolute shite when used at LFWD and the switches have been played to him he can't even get in front of his defender and get them down when Mane who's about 6 inches shorter wins and gets those balls down all the fucking time game in game out

[jr81]

They got a draw in this fixture last season, and we had a stronger team than tonight's. Though the title was already won by then. It's a good job Mane is out there, can't see anyone else scoring, they are welcome to prove me wrong.

United found them very hard to break down recently also. Burnley sat very deep that game until the last 10mins. They actually had 2 decent chances in those 9l10mins when they decided to play.
Expect much the same tonight.

[Insidious]

Wait, Shaqiri, Origi and Mane played against Barca.

*taps head knowingly*

[skyebo]

United found them very hard to break down recently also. Burnley sat very deep that game until the last 10mins. They actually had 2 decent chances in those 9l10mins when they decided to play.
Expect much the same tonight.

Indeed.

[Nineteenx]

I think Jurgen is thinking ahead to the FA Cup and Spurs games

[miller0863]

Hendo not fit, felt a knock. Firmino and Mo rested.

[LEGS]

Im with 19 on this Origi has to play through the middle.

Minamino will think its harsh he hasnt been picked but I can see why Klopp has gone for Origi.

A scrappy 1-0 will do cant say im looking forward to it.

[miller0863]

Burnley isn’t the best fixture to bring Minnie meano in, he’d get flattened

[Steveo]

Sizist..!

[miller0863]

Realist

[faridtoxteth]

When as he ever demonstrated any of these things? He's absolutely useless in the fucking air, when he's been consistently absolute shite when used at LFWD and the switches have been played to him he can't even get in front of his defender and get them down when Mane who's about 6 inches shorter wins and gets those balls down all the fucking time game in game out

I was being kind of ironic about Origi who has been awful for ages. (Although he did score a late header against Newcastle (was it?) in the late run in to our nearly league season.) I was more pointing out Burnley's 'style' of football and how he might actually be useful defending corners. I agree Mane is a great header of the ball in comparison.

[Steveo]

Realist



I know BUT he might have been able to run through their legs without them knowing.. :D

[Nineteenx]

Wait, Shaqiri, Origi and Mane played against Barca.

*taps head knowingly*

yeah and Hendo, Trent and Shaq put the goals on a plate for Gini and Origi

[faridtoxteth]

Burnley isn’t the best fixture to bring Minnie meano in, he’d get flattened

Completely agree. I had a 'debate' with Noods on another thread a couple of days ago about Burnley being the dirtiest, least footballing, team in the prem, although he thought Everton were dirtier.

[Steveo]

yeah and Hendo, Trent and Shaq put the goals on a plate for Gini and Origi

Are you referencing Hendo’s powder puff shot that THANK Origi was in position and finished like a true goal poacher.? And Trent’s smart quick corner - again finished superbly by Origi...?

[skyebo]

Completely agree. I had a 'debate' with Noods on another thread a couple of days ago about Burnley being the dirtiest, least footballing, team in the prem, although he thought Everton were dirtier.

Let me introduce you to WBA under Allardyce.

[Nineteenx]

Are you referencing Hendo’s powder puff shot that Origi finished like a true goal poacher.? And Trent’s smart quick corner - again finished superbly by Origi...?

The one he tried to place past the keeper low by his legs having taking the ball on and burst between 2 defenders to create the chance and the keeper just got a leg to?

Can't believe you can't even give the lad credit for being the player to make our all important early opening goal in that game possible, I know you're not a fan, I didn't realise you were a revisionist