The rest of the season

[Nineteenx]

We need to look to build some form and consistency and gradually add more ability to play through sides while retaining our incredible ability when being direct, we need both.

Hopefully we can now get a run of as many games as possible with something like a settled side as that's a huge part of why we haven't been consistent, our consistency was born out of incredible continuity of selection and formation and we played quicker for that reason, because every single player knew the other player and their interactions and movements in that set up inside out.

There are lots of brilliant, best in Europe relationships we had in our team the last 3 seasons that have simply broken down through too much chopping and changing some of it enforced, some of it sadly self inflicted, we need to get those working to their highest levels again.

One thing we have to make sure of is keeping the balance of having options on both sides to attack and maybe belatedly learn the lesson that every time we field a player who constantly comes short instead of making runs in behind and playing on the line and in the half space at LFWD we just nullify our left side ourselves. I must have seen us do that in 30 games in the last 3 seasons, either starting or from the bench and it's a fucking disaster

Miracles do happen, let's just work harder than ever to be the best Liverpool team we possibly can be, to have as much consistency of selection and formation as possible, rekindle the best in Europe onfield relationships and interactions we've broken down largely ourselves through too much tinkering and chopping and changing so we're consistently playing quicker and doing things automatically as we used to and get back into the best possible form we can and win as many games as we can being the Liverpool that have been so brilliant the past 3 seasons and see where that takes us

[CCTV]

Our best season imo was the 18/19 season where we had more tactical flexibility than last season.

Really our main issue is breaking down these stubborn defensive units.
Whether that be an Atletico or a lower table side. The low block which we did get better at breaking down probably needs more tactical variation. Sacrificing a workhorse for a bit more flair.

One of the obvious differences between ours and peps city is the dynamic between wide forwards and fullbacks. They often play their attackers extremely wide which stretches the defense and makes runners from deep task of finding space easier.

Whether that be an inside run for a fullback to get a shooting opportunity or a midfielder breaking forward centrally. Both potentially getting into crosses too.
Our wide forwards given their greater skill on the ball, particularly Salah with his close control dribbling but Mane too when pinned wide are a far greater threat than Robbo or Trent who typically provide the width in our attacking phases.
You can't leave a player 1v1 with either in a wide position as if either beats a solitary man has a bit of momentum they are hard to stop.

Player quality will always have an impact naturally enough, but more tactical variation would benefit us massively imo. Also copying a few tweaks from peps setup wouldn't be the worst idea
A few people believe it's their midfielders that make the difference, ie player quality, but their approach to possession football, wide wide forwards against buses can't be overlooked imo.

There are probably 6 or 7 sides we could use this approach with each season and they are sides who I'd normally expect to be dispatched with ease by city.

[LEGS]

What we could do with is one of our CM to be capable of shooting from outside the box.

A striker who gets in the box and is an aerial threat would help.

That is all the tactical advice I can be bothered to type.

[skyebo]

What difference has Thiago made to the team ? Answers on a postcard.

[skyebo]

What we could do with is one of our CM to be capable of shooting from outside the box.

A striker who gets in the box and is an aerial threat would help.

That is all the tactical advice I can be bothered to type.

Scoring from anywhere would do.

[LEGS]

Scoring from anywhere would do.

Sure would be but having someone who has a good shot on them would give low block teams something else to think about.

[skyebo]

Sure would be but having someone who has a good shot on them would give low block teams something else to think about.

The only midfielder who has that in him is Oxlade-Chamberlain, and he's hardly ever fit.

[sydenham red]

Sure would be but having someone who has a good shot on them would give low block teams something else to think about.

Someone who can hit 25-30 yarders qccurately from the centre and is willing to keep trying them would be a godsend. Means that defensive block has more to.think about than moving out to either wing. or the corners of the 18yd box

[Steveo]

What difference has Thiago made to the team ? Answers on a postcard.

He hasn’t been able to play in any kind of a settled side. Perhaps the only real glimpse we got was v the BS.. In the main after return from injury he has played in front of a makeshift defence AND behind an attack without any form. Not the easiest of introductions to be fair.

[skyebo]

He hasn’t been able to play in any kind of a settled side. Perhaps the only real glimpse we got was v the BS.. In the main after return from injury he has played in front of a makeshift defence AND behind an attack without any form. Not the easiest of introductions to be fair.

That shouldn't affect what he's capable of doing.

[Steveo]

That shouldn't affect what he's capable of doing.

Possibly but have any of the midfield performed excellently since the loss of both CB’s?

[skyebo]

Possibly but have any of the midfield performed excellently since the loss of both CB’s?

We haven't played well for a while aside from Tottenham and West Ham, you can carry a couple of players in a game but when most of them are sub par, you have a problem.

[justme]

Thiago may well be a good passer of the ball. But hes not gonna get the space to pass little clever balls down the sides. of the players. they will get cut out a lot of the time. Teams have worked us out and we insist on playing the same way to get ourselves out of it.
i will be interested to see who we sign in the summer.. teams will not change the way the play against us. they are happy with a draw and maybe nick a goal..
Its hard to accept teams are sooooo defensive they make it impossible for us to get any space.to play in. But in the end its all about results. If they get a draw they are more than happy. Its how we change it. We wont win the league again playing the same way..

We have to find ways in the final 3rd and that's not over playing the ball. I would be happy if we got a player with a bit of physicality so he can attacker the ball in the air in the box. You can always get second balls then. Right now we will never score in a brothel. You can blame all the tiredness you want.. We haven't scored in 5 games in the last 7/8 games.

[LEGS]

Andre Silva at Frankfurt is having a few good seasons.

One to keep an eye on.

[LFC-DPG]

The only midfielder who has that in him is Oxlade-Chamberlain, and he's hardly ever fit.

Shaq has a decent shot too but last night he didn’t attempt anything from range.

[Nineteenx]

What difference has Thiago made to the team ? Answers on a postcard.

Skyebo, as with a lot of things you make such remarks about, pretty much the same as a lot of others to be fair, just please try, if you have it in you, to compare apples with apples, not with pineapples, way too many stupid things said and questioning of players going on here comparing performances and players to the last 2 seasons when we played with an incredibly settled 14 or 15 of our very best players and started the best 11 of those practically every game, when VAR was actually being used for the purposes of its inception and we didn't have a ridiculous fixture schedule, when this season is entirely different, trying to measure Thiago, Bobby any of them against theirs or other players form and performances of the last 2 seasons is a fucking nonsense

Let's maybe ask these questions when we get back to full strength and players have had a run of games with 9 or 10 of our best players, it would be more relevant

[TheDOC1979]

A decent run in the CL with some effort being shown, finish in the top four and I'll be happy with that.

Miracles do happen, but they need to happen with how we play first.

[teesred]

He hasn’t been able to play in any kind of a settled side. Perhaps the only real glimpse we got was v the BS.. In the main after return from injury he has played in front of a makeshift defence AND behind an attack without any form. Not the easiest of introductions to be fair.

Totally agree. Theres too much negativity towards him at the moment. Hes not able to do what he was brought in to do yet. Next season is probably when we see what hes capabe of.

[teesred]

Our best season imo was the 18/19 season where we had more tactical flexibility than last season.

Really our main issue is breaking down these stubborn defensive units.
Whether that be an Atletico or a lower table side. The low block which we did get better at breaking down probably needs more tactical variation. Sacrificing a workhorse for a bit more flair.

One of the obvious differences between ours and peps city is the dynamic between wide forwards and fullbacks. They often play their attackers extremely wide which stretches the defense and makes runners from deep task of finding space easier.

Whether that be an inside run for a fullback to get a shooting opportunity or a midfielder breaking forward centrally. Both potentially getting into crosses too.
Our wide forwards given their greater skill on the ball, particularly Salah with his close control dribbling but Mane too when pinned wide are a far greater threat than Robbo or Trent who typically provide the width in our attacking phases.
You can't leave a player 1v1 with either in a wide position as if either beats a solitary man has a bit of momentum they are hard to stop.

Player quality will always have an impact naturally enough, but more tactical variation would benefit us massively imo. Also copying a few tweaks from peps setup wouldn't be the worst idea
A few people believe it's their midfielders that make the difference, ie player quality, but their approach to possession football, wide wide forwards against buses can't be overlooked imo.

There are probably 6 or 7 sides we could use this approach with each season and they are sides who I'd normally expect to be dispatched with ease by city.

This is where I am at too. For what its worth.
I dont see why lasnite we needed both Gini and Milner, especially after the latter had played on sunday and hes 35.
Jones came on sunday and made a difference yet was benched again, Ox- god knows what he does or does not do in training but if you cant get a game at home against Brighton in place of our veteran who had played 3 days before its not looking good for you.

[justme]

This is where I am at too. For what its worth.
I dont see why lasnite we needed both Gini and Milner, especially after the latter had played on sunday and hes 35.
Jones came on sunday and made a difference yet was benched again, Ox- god knows what he does or does not do in training but if you cant get a game at home against Brighton in place of our veteran who had played 3 days before its not looking good for you.
its fatigue you see. Jones and Ox have played non stop all season..

[justme]

Klopp is the best manager we have had in the last 30 + years..thats obvious and I don't want him to ever leave..But of late hes done some strange things in decision making. (not that im any form of expert). Just some of the choices his made in players on the pitch has me confused. Take Minamino he played his best game for us against Palace and he was never seen again.
Any decent offer in the summer and he will be gone.we wont see him again full stop. Its the same last night.. I know Mane is not fit.But our left side was strange. I dont even know who was playing there even now.

we had options in the sense Oxlade could have played there and come in on his right.. Jones has played there a couple of times as well. Shaqiri was never going to keep the width on the left.Guess Origi is not fancied at all.

[RedNoodle]

This is where I am at too. For what its worth.
I dont see why lasnite we needed both Gini and Milner, especially after the latter had played on sunday and hes 35.
Jones came on sunday and made a difference yet was benched again, Ox- god knows what he does or does not do in training but if you cant get a game at home against Brighton in place of our veteran who had played 3 days before its not looking good for you.

The likes of Wijnaldum, Milner, Henderson (when he's actually played in midfield) etc are for the most part 'functional' at best. They inject some energy into midfield, and they give our defence a bit of protection, but not much else. Once you remove or reduce the amount of 'energy' they give (which was always going to happen e.g. being overplayed, Milner's age etc), you are left with a midfield that offers practically zero.

If Klopp isn't playing certain players, we really should be asking serious questions as to why this is, especially given how p.poor our squad is in terms of fit, quality options. If the likes of Minamino, Chamberlain, Jones, Tsimikas, etc can't get a game under current circumstances, when will they? It seems that Klopp just doesn't rate/trust them, which then raises serious questions as to whose idea it was to bring these players in, and why they were brought in.

We have a fair few players who are either injury plagued, and/or just not rated by Klopp. In order to get us back on top we need to shift out all of these players and replace them with, fit, quality players, ones that Klopp does actually want to play. However as it stands I just can't see the second part of that equation happening, and we 'all' know why that is.

[faridtoxteth]

I wouldn't say Henderson is 'functional at best'. I think one of the reasons we have dipped is because he is playing at the back and not in midfield.
I think we are just also generally having a reaction to three years of unbelievable mental concentration.

[CCTV]

What difference has Thiago made to the team ? Answers on a postcard.

Not had the best of luck since joining us with his own and others injuries, with the team not performing to it's best.
By my eye he looks to add some tempo to our passing in midfield, has better spatial awareness than the others in midfield and can ping a pass. Does his caring share off the ball and isn't shy of getting stuck in to it.

Statistically... PL ONLY he hasn't played in the CL yet.

Hes had the most shots per game of our midfielders
For a short arse hes won as many headers per game as any of our midfielders
Has made as many tackles per game as fabinho in the squad, the most interceptions per game in the squad, and following on the most tackles&intercepts per game.

For example Gini has made 1.6 tackles-or-assists per game compared to Thiagos 4 tackles-or-assists per game.
He has 2.6 fouls per game, a few yellows too, so hes breaking up play a lot relatively.

Hes second for dribbles per game to Mane.
Of our midfielders only shaq has more key passes per game. Thiago has the most long passes per game in the squad.
His passes per game is high too. Of our midfielders only Fabinho and Hendo have been dispossessed less. Both beat him on passes per game as well but maybe these last few stats are down to their playing CB a bit this season.

[CCTV]

Fair share:)

Also fabinho has more headers won per game, hes tied with Gini.

[Kev0909]

people expect thiago to play at his best when he's not played much for us and had a injury-stop-start season so far for us.... but no posts about giving him time to "settle"

yet putting davies in against Brighton... is crazy and the last thing that should be done, and carry on playing midfielders there... and at least he's been in this country and played divison below so kinda use to it

this forum :D

[CCTV]

Skyebo, as with a lot of things you make such remarks about, pretty much the same as a lot of others to be fair, just please try, if you have it in you, to compare apples with apples, not with pineapples, way too many stupid things said and questioning of players going on here comparing performances and players to the last 2 seasons when we played with an incredibly settled 14 or 15 of our very best players and started the best 11 of those practically every game, when VAR was actually being used for the purposes of its inception and we didn't have a ridiculous fixture schedule, when this season is entirely different, trying to measure Thiago, Bobby any of them against theirs or other players form and performances of the last 2 seasons is a fucking nonsense

Let's maybe ask these questions when we get back to full strength and players have had a run of games with 9 or 10 of our best players, it would be more relevant

It was a simple question :D

He didn't ask you why the toilet was blocked :D

[RedNoodle]

I wouldn't say Henderson is 'functional at best'. I think one of the reasons we have dipped is because he is playing at the back and not in midfield.
I think we are just also generally having a reaction to three years of unbelievable mental concentration.

I said "for the most part". Yes Henderson can play a nice pass, and he can score the odd quality goal, but neither happen often enough to say that they are a 'major' part of his game. He is however one of our most consistent players. With those things being the case, yes of course we would miss his presence in midfield, however our problems run much, much deeper than simply Henderson being played out of position.

We have a thin/weak as pee squad, meaning that as soon as we have a few injuries, or have a few players off form, we start having serious problems. One of our major issues is that we are not creative or clinical enough in attack, and a large part of that is because our midfield effectively offers very close to the sum total of sod all when it comes to goals and creativity. That puts huge pressure on the same three players to come up with the goods game after game. All three have at best been 'inconsistent' as of late, never mind that Mane is missing. That and our defence not being watertight means that the opposition currently only have to score a solitary goal to have a good chance of getting a good result against us.

We have a good (but not unimprovable) first XI, one or two decent options (e.g. Jota when not ruled out by a moment of insanity/stupidity), but beyond that the drop off in quality, fitness, and consistency (in a good way) is humongous. That has been the case for far, far too long and it needs to stop, however under FSG I doubt it will.

[Steveo]

this forum :D

And again :D


https://youtu.be/Efx0ZtYDVaY

[Insidious]

A decent run in the CL with some effort being shown, finish in the top four and I'll be happy with that.

Miracles do happen, but they need to happen with how we play first.

In terms of the Champion's League, plus some improvements in how we play, I really hope we manage to get past Leipzig, even if it's an underwhelming scrape or grind.

If I'm not mistaken (and there aren't any Covid-influenced changes) we wouldn't play a Quarter-final until the 6th or 7th of April. In footballing terms, two months is a pretty long period of time, which would hopefully give us the opportunity to have bedded in one of the centre-backs and a more settled midfield could potentially go into the first leg with a little bit of rhythm.

Just want to beat Leipzig in any manner to give ourselves that chance.

[CCTV]

This is where I am at too. For what its worth.
I dont see why lasnite we needed both Gini and Milner, especially after the latter had played on sunday and hes 35.
Jones came on sunday and made a difference yet was benched again, Ox- god knows what he does or does not do in training but if you cant get a game at home against Brighton in place of our veteran who had played 3 days before its not looking good for you.

Fox has barely played this season, guess klopp trying to build up the brittle fella. Seems to have an issue with a few of those in the squad. Naby & Matip similar, Gomez a little less so.

Jones has done well enough but everytime I've seen him play he seems to be playing within himself. When he gets his chances he needs to get stuck in and push himself to do a lot more with the ball.
Harsh criticism as I think his ability or ceiling is far higher than his contributions.
Compared to old man Milner, Jones has been a bit too tame and reserved imo.

4231 the other night would have worked best imo, Milner left, Shaq right and Bobby off Salah.

[Nineteenx]

Re Thiago he has played around 8-10 absolutely sublime balls across his games that were he playing in a settled system with the same 14-15 players week in week out would have resulted in a forward being on the end of them to assist or score, but the players aren't yet alive to what he can deliver from where because they've not had enough games with him in a settled side

[Kev0909]

Re Thiago he has played around 8-10 absolutely sublime balls across his games that were he playing in a settled system with the same 14-15 players week in week out would have resulted in a forward being on the end of them to assist or score, but the players aren't yet alive to what he can deliver from where because they've not had enough games with him in a settled side

I think he's done quite a bit of defensive work too that's gone unnoticed, at times a little rash but makes a change a player getting stuck in!

although I hope he saves most of it for everton I don't care, break some fkin legs

[reddownunder]

Our best season imo was the 18/19 season where we had more tactical flexibility than last season.

Really our main issue is breaking down these stubborn defensive units.
Whether that be an Atletico or a lower table side. The low block which we did get better at breaking down probably needs more tactical variation. Sacrificing a workhorse for a bit more flair.

One of the obvious differences between ours and peps city is the dynamic between wide forwards and fullbacks. They often play their attackers extremely wide which stretches the defense and makes runners from deep task of finding space easier.

Whether that be an inside run for a fullback to get a shooting opportunity or a midfielder breaking forward centrally. Both potentially getting into crosses too.
Our wide forwards given their greater skill on the ball, particularly Salah with his close control dribbling but Mane too when pinned wide are a far greater threat than Robbo or Trent who typically provide the width in our attacking phases.
You can't leave a player 1v1 with either in a wide position as if either beats a solitary man has a bit of momentum they are hard to stop.

Player quality will always have an impact naturally enough, but more tactical variation would benefit us massively imo. Also copying a few tweaks from peps setup wouldn't be the worst idea
A few people believe it's their midfielders that make the difference, ie player quality, but their approach to possession football, wide wide forwards against buses can't be overlooked imo.

There are probably 6 or 7 sides we could use this approach with each season and they are sides who I'd normally expect to be dispatched with ease by city.

When struggling against defensive tactics I wonder why Klopp doesn't try switching Salah and Mane to their natural sides to try and stretch defences. Or play 3 at the back and give licence for Trent and Robbo to all out attack

[RedNoodle]

When struggling against defensive tactics I wonder why Klopp doesn't try switching Salah and Mane to their natural sides to try and stretch defences. Or play 3 at the back and give licence for Trent and Robbo to all out attack

Possibly because he/we only have one main way of playing, hence why you can often tell in the first ten to fifteen minutes how our games are liable to play out. I know some won't like to hear, never mind admit that's a possibility, but the evidence suggests that it definitely is.

[jozza800]

They just need to speed the game up. We're far too pedestrian at home. As soon as any space opens up we're not quick enough to exploit it.

It's a capable squad, when everyone is fully fit. But when you're missing half a side you're going to struggle.

Tactically, the only change I would make against the 'bus parkers' is to not play Gini and Thiago together. And i'd be more inclined to leave Gini out in these games. He's fantastic in games against bigger sides but he keeps hold of the ball for too long and tends to pass backwards in too often iin the games against the smaller teams.

Assuming that we Fab back or we play one of the new CBs my midfield against the poor sides would be something like -

Henderson - Thiago - Jones/Ox/Keita

[skyebo]

Re Thiago he has played around 8-10 absolutely sublime balls across his games that were he playing in a settled system with the same 14-15 players week in week out would have resulted in a forward being on the end of them to assist or score, but the players aren't yet alive to what he can deliver from where because they've not had enough games with him in a settled side

So basically, what you're saying is, those 8-10 balls didn't find a team mate, they went to an opponent ?. What we should do now is call those passes wasteful instead, because if that would have been Fabinho attempting them, that's how you would have described them. It's only fair don't you think ?. When these so called sublime passes regularly find a team mate, i will gladly praise him for his contributions, until then i will continue to be puzzled as to why he's yet to make a difference to the team. Criticising youngsters who have only just come into the team seems to be normal, but when a player has won so many titles, has to wait until certain players are alongside him before he shows his true form then maybe he isn't or won't be as good as people think.

[teesred]

Possibly because he/we only have one main way of playing, hence why you can often tell in the first ten to fifteen minutes how our games are liable to play out. I know some won't like to hear, never mind admit that's a possibility, but the evidence suggests that it definitely is.

Agree. It isn't what anyone wants to hear but its definitely evident.
We cant carry on regardless even when everyone is fully fit. Something needs to change.
The two main issues of low block teams and Firminos role/form aren't new. This has been happening for over a year now and is getting worse, results show that.
We had a fully fit side for all of last season and still came up against stubborn sides, we just had a lot of luck go our way.

[TheDOC1979]

Klopp is the best manager we have had in the last 30 + years..thats obvious and I don't want him to ever leave..But of late hes done some strange things in decision making. (not that im any form of expert). Just some of the choices his made in players on the pitch has me confused. Take Minamino he played his best game for us against Palace and he was never seen again.
Any decent offer in the summer and he will be gone.we wont see him again full stop. Its the same last night.. I know Mane is not fit.But our left side was strange. I dont even know who was playing there even now.

we had options in the sense Oxlade could have played there and come in on his right.. Jones has played there a couple of times as well. Shaqiri was never going to keep the width on the left.Guess Origi is not fancied at all.

His recent press conference suggests the term mental fatigue had nothing to do with mental health (which isn’t a diagnosis) fair enough. Says we just weren’t fresh enough. Has lallana pissed off with the Nivea sponsor??

Not sure how much fresher you can be?

Think Steveo or cctv mentioned that we should’ve freshened up the squad to be able to compete in one of the transfer windows. On the highest level. Quality and quantity have to be used in combination here. The likes of united, Chelsea and City to an extent dominated because they had a subs bench better than most teams.

No true competition in the ranks at all and when there’s is, they aren’t used when they’re playing well.

[justme]

So basically, what you're saying is, those 8-10 balls didn't find a team mate, they went to an opponent ?. What we should do now is call those passes wasteful instead, because if that would have been Fabinho attempting them, that's how you would have described them. It's only fair don't you think ?. When these so called sublime passes regularly find a team mate, i will gladly praise him for his contributions, until then i will continue to be puzzled as to why he's yet to make a difference to the team. Criticising youngsters who have only just come into the team seems to be normal, but when a player has won so many titles, has to wait until certain players are alongside him before he shows his true form then maybe he isn't or won't be as good as people think.
Nineteenx is also obsessed with the diagonal balls. He doesnt seem to grasp theres fuck all space in between the fullback and wide man to play it. In fact half the time Salah is being man handled . since its Salah the refs and linesmen cheat and ignore it. So there you have it.

[justme]

His recent press conference suggests the term mental fatigue had nothing to do with mental health (which isn’t a diagnosis) fair enough. Says we just weren’t fresh enough. Has lallana pissed off with the Nivea sponsor??

Not sure how much fresher you can be?

Think Steveo or cctv mentioned that we should’ve freshened up the squad to be able to compete in one of the transfer windows. On the highest level. Quality and quantity have to be used in combination here. The likes of united, Chelsea and City to an extent dominated because they had a subs bench better than most teams.

No true competition in the ranks at all and when there’s is, they aren’t used when they’re playing well.

I dont think the mental fatigue as anything to do with the facts we have failed to score in half a dozen games of late.
Just the lack of attacking options in the final 3rd. Apart from Jota.. we havent had any long term injuries of note. We only have 1 centre forward in the club and hes a false number 9.

[justme]

next season the owners need to stop worrying about the coffers and refuse to have so many 12:30 kick offs.
And as well. they need to understand has fans. WE HATE seeing the likes of Baldy winning.. and dip into the funds and give Klopp has much has he requires.

[Steveo]

Next season there will be much tinkering...and that's not a pop at the Traveller community..




https://youtu.be/3arzjnCTjco

[Nineteenx]

Let's just beat UAE FC, trust either new CB alongside Fab and have a run of games with our best midfield Thiago Henderson Wijnaldum and our long term best front 3 up top, get all the relationships and interactions working as well as ever but with a little more variation with Thiago in midfield, ease Jota back to full fitness as a supersub initially and have the option to bring Davies on for one of the mids to move Fab to an out and out sitting DM where he's played at his best for us to see games out and see where that takes us

No constantly dropping off players at LFWD, give Ox a start if Mane's rested and use Jota at No9 or RFWD and if when back to full fitness Jota does usurp Bobby the if we give Mo 20 minutes rest get Bobby on for him with Jota moving to RFWD

[eggy81]

So basically, what you're saying is, those 8-10 balls didn't find a team mate, they went to an opponent ?. What we should do now is call those passes wasteful instead, because if that would have been Fabinho attempting them, that's how you would have described them. It's only fair don't you think ?. When these so called sublime passes regularly find a team mate, i will gladly praise him for his contributions, until then i will continue to be puzzled as to why he's yet to make a difference to the team. Criticising youngsters who have only just come into the team seems to be normal, but when a player has won so many titles, has to wait until certain players are alongside him before he shows his true form then maybe he isn't or won't be as good as people think.
Indeed

[Nineteenx]

So basically, what you're saying is, those 8-10 balls didn't find a team mate, they went to an opponent ?. What we should do now is call those passes wasteful instead, because if that would have been Fabinho attempting them, that's how you would have described them. It's only fair don't you think ?. When these so called sublime passes regularly find a team mate, i will gladly praise him for his contributions, until then i will continue to be puzzled as to why he's yet to make a difference to the team. Criticising youngsters who have only just come into the team seems to be normal, but when a player has won so many titles, has to wait until certain players are alongside him before he shows his true form then maybe he isn't or won't be as good as people think.

No, those balls didn't go straight to an opponent, some went out, some went to the keeper, they were each and everyone of them top quality that had the forwards been more alive to and aware of the new possibilities Thiago brings, playing together in a settled side they'd have been on the end of, all balls that if the forwards were switched on and more used to and aware of they'd have comfortably got to first and been in

In a way what Thiago is doing is prompting and trying to initiate the greater variation of movement to unlock teams and it will click, it's part of the process

[ianlfc]

The problem with Thiago is I was hoping he was going to be a midfield match winner ,but the early indications are he's more a keep the ball moving, setter upper type of player. If Mo and Sadio don't score we seem to be fucked, to put it politely. As there's no goals coming from the midfield.

[Nineteenx]

The problem with Thiago is I was hoping he was going to be a midfield match winner ,but the early indications are he's more a keep the ball moving, setter upper type of player. If Mo and Sadio don't score we seem to be fucked, to put it politely. As there's no goals coming from the midfield.

He's a setter upper, assist but mostly pass before the assist type, quite hopeful we belatedly do more with our full backs, they should have been contributing the goals an attacking midfielder they're played so high in placw of would these last 2 seasons, especially Robbo, he should have scored 8-10 both seasons, he got played in through the channel between their RB and RCB in great positions to so many times and against ptb teams at that

One thing all our players need educating on is playing the percentages in certain situations instead of trying to score the perfect goal, they're not even remotely streetwise or savvy at that, Robbo wasted practically every single one of his golden opportunities trying to pick a 3-4 yard centre, when we were never scoring like that and were far more likely to score if he'd gone for goal smashing it across the keeper for the bottom corner, he scores, keeper saves and our lad or one of their defenders bundles the parry in

Whenever our forwards mids or fbs are looking for a pass across to a player the path to is blocked they need to just drill in a shot that side and play the percentages we'd likely score another 15-20 goals a season doing that

Look at jesus' goal v Burnley, Silva hit his shot as he did, where he did for exactly the reasons i'm talking about, he knew if the keeper saved it there was a good chance it would fall to Jesus to bundle home

We're really clueless at things like that

[RedNoodle]

I just read that Southampton have won one of their last nine matches, and that was against us. Everything I'm seeing, hearing, and reading is increasingly making me think that this season is going to be a complete 'right off', which could well end up having some very bad knock on effects.

[justme]

I just read that Southampton have won one of their last nine matches, and that was against us. Everything I'm seeing, hearing, and reading is increasingly making me think that this season is going to be a complete 'right off', which could well end up having some very bad knock on effects.

Brighton will lose next time they play. they will be suffering from FATIGUE having run themselves into the ground against us

[redebreck]

Thiago may well be a good passer of the ball. But hes not gonna get the space to pass little clever balls down the sides. of the players. they will get cut out a lot of the time. Teams have worked us out and we insist on playing the same way to get ourselves out of it.
i will be interested to see who we sign in the summer.. teams will not change the way the play against us. they are happy with a draw and maybe nick a goal..

there we have it. we don't seem to have a plan B. it seems we can only play one way, and when it doesn't work, we're fecked.


Possibly because he/we only have one main way of playing, hence why you can often tell in the first ten to fifteen minutes how our games are liable to play out. I know some won't like to hear, never mind admit that's a possibility, but the evidence suggests that it definitely is.

spot on.


They just need to speed the game up. We're far too pedestrian at home. As soon as any space opens up we're not quick enough to exploit it.

It's a capable squad, when everyone is fully fit. But when you're missing half a side you're going to struggle.


I've seen it so many times this season, it's frustrating we don't do more with the ball when it reaches someone out wide, in space. Instead of fizzing it across the box, we play backwards and sideways, allowing the opponents to rebuild their banks of four (five in some cases).


Nineteenx is also obsessed with the diagonal balls. He doesnt seem to grasp theres fuck all space in between the fullback and wide man to play it. In fact half the time Salah is being man handled . since its Salah, the refs and linesmen cheat and ignore it. So there you have it.

if Salah was English we'd be laughing.

[Nineteenx]

Just get back to playing as we did at our very best, more direct, moving the ball quickly, playing our fucking switches for fucks sake, win as many games as we possibly can, including all our champions league games as we're the only team who can stop City doing the quadruple

[dicko1969]

Wasnt mane pushed in the back ... 2 hands before goal no2

[dicko1969]

We all know what the situation is.
But I bet on fb pages all the African experts will be calling for klopp to go.
Or will be stating they are the best manager and know everything.

The history of this season.

1. Vvd (pen and red card) and Thiago injury
2. Mane 'offside' was never offside

3. The Brighton penalty where Robbo's air from his boot mysteriously fells Welbeck.

So that's 4 points ROBBED !

4. The 4centre backs OUT ! 3 all season.
5. We should have got a CB in 1st January.

6. As a consequence the key December January period ...
WBA Newcastle Fulham Draws
Defeat Burnley Brighton.

7. The only klopp mistake... playing Jota v the mitytddjjj team.

Which then sets the tone for the moment now.
Struggling for confidence and snapping around for chances .

Lets hope a change of mindset in the CL.

GONNA be really tough to get top 4 now.
One thing needed to remind the players nothing is guaranteed in football.

Top 4 is now a fight !

[CCTV]

Wasnt mane pushed in the back ... 2 hands before goal no2

Yup, a clear foul, there are sneaky ways to push in the back but that was very clear and obvious.

[dicko1969]

So why wasn't it given?
Why didn't VAR go back to that?
Just like VAR did go back for Firmino hand ball v WHU and goal disallowed ?

[dicko1969]

Next 4games league

Everton
Sheff Utd
Fulham
Wolves

MUST 12 POINTS !

in march as it stands only 3 games for the month !

Could be without a game for 3 weeks from 13 march to 3 April.

[CCTV]

So why wasn't it given?
Why didn't VAR go back to that?
Just like VAR did go back for Firmino hand ball v WHU and goal disallowed ?

I don't about var, it was clear and obvious etc the handball rule has been applied autistically as per the rules.

The ref and linesman should have spotted it though. It was very hard to miss.

[dicko1969]

I haven't seen it a second time.
But it was a clear push... right ?

[CCTV]

I haven't seen it a second time.
But it was a clear push... right ?

https://mobile.twitter.com/Benxlfc/status/1360592939387412487

[Nineteenx]

If you're talking about VAR, how is their lad missing the ball and catching Mo's foot, however slight, certainly more contact than Robbo/Wellbeck not a pen, yet Thiago standing his ground and not moving out of the way and Barnes running into him and throwing himself to ground a free kick, it was about the fourth free kick they got from their player running into one of ours and throwing himself to ground and Taylor couldn't wait to give any of them, despite none of them being fucking fouls

The lad catching Mo's foot, if that happens in our area on Vardy, however slight the contact, you fucking KNOW those dirty stitch up VAR cunts are giving a pen, you know for certain because they've already given the one against Robbo when the outstep of his right foot made the slightest of contact with Wellshit's outstep, so how is it a fucking pen for Brighton then and not for us?

Our owners power grab has royally shafted our lads this season, that's when this VAR and refereeing shite started, as for confidence, the mentality monsters confidence has been shot because the officials have been continually robbing the lads

[Steveo]

Probably correct 19.

And we did play well for much of that game today. Excellent in fact for much of it.

The power grab though - well It certainly didn’t help

[CCTV]

If you're talking about VAR, how is their lad missing the ball and catching Mo's foot, however slight, certainly more contact than Robbo/Wellbeck not a pen, yet Thiago standing his ground and not moving out of the way and Barnes running into him and throwing himself to ground a free kick, it was about the fourth free kick they got from their player running into one of ours and throwing himself to ground and Taylor couldn't wait to give any of them, despite none of them being fucking fouls

The lad catching Mo's foot, if that happens in our area on Vardy, however slight the contact, you fucking KNOW those dirty stitch up VAR cunts are giving a pen, you know for certain because they've already given the one against Robbo when the outstep of his right foot made the slightest of contact with Wellshit's outstep, so how is it a fucking pen for Brighton then and not for us?

Our owners power grab has royally shafted our lads this season, that's when this VAR and refereeing shite started, as for confidence, the mentality monsters confidence has been shot because the officials have been continually robbing the lads

The anti-liverpool bias is a lot older

[Steveo]

The anti-liverpool bias is a lot older

100%

[redebreck]

If you're talking about VAR, how is their lad missing the ball and catching Mo's foot, however slight, certainly more contact than Robbo/Wellbeck not a pen, yet Thiago standing his ground and not moving out of the way and Barnes running into him and throwing himself to ground a free kick, it was about the fourth free kick they got from their player running into one of ours and throwing himself to ground and Taylor couldn't wait to give any of them, despite none of them being fucking fouls

The lad catching Mo's foot, if that happens in our area on Vardy, however slight the contact, you fucking KNOW those dirty stitch up VAR cunts are giving a pen, you know for certain because they've already given the one against Robbo when the outstep of his right foot made the slightest of contact with Wellshit's outstep, so how is it a fucking pen for Brighton then and not for us?

Our owners power grab has royally shafted our lads this season, that's when this VAR and refereeing shite started, as for confidence, the mentality monsters confidence has been shot because the officials have been continually robbing the lads

Totally agree there's something wrong.
The question /problem is, what can be done about it? Other teams are being affected, possibly not as much as we are, so how can it be resolved?

[skyebo]

Totally agree there's something wrong.
The question /problem is, what can be done about it? Other teams are being affected, possibly not as much as we are, so how can it be resolved?

Make sure all the officials come from Liverpool, but make sure they have no connections with Everton Man Utd or Man City. It's ok to have connections with the other clubs as they are not rivals, or a threat to our title.

[Artisan]

VAR just giving city a penalty. Just because we say its a conspiracy doesn't mean its not.

[Steveo]

Absolutely - IMO though If anyone has been getting the decisions this season it’s United. It’s been like Ferguson has been back.

Think it’s more that we have been handicapped. But it does tend to feel like that when results don’t go your way.

[southernboy]

I wonder how much our own biases effect our judgment. I thought that was a soft penalty for City, but the commentators and pundits are unanimous that it was a clear pen. I don’t know anymore.

[Kev0909]

I think maybe City are by far the best in form team in the league and spurs aren't very good so maybe that's why city are winning?

Just maybe ?

Anyone from 5th-10th dropping pts is good for us now eitherway

[eggy81]

MSN kloppo looks absolutely shattered in the interviews. Very fearful of a full scale collapse this season now

[dicko1969]

VAR really is awful.
What was it LIVARPOOL
LOL
certainly isn't this season as it wasn't last season.
I think manutd had a lot of decisions to get 4th spot.
I wonder how corrupt VAR is.

Every single week it goes against LIVARPOOL.

[GizmoD12]

Loris fuk me. Terrible

[Kev0909]

Loris fuk me. Terrible

Much worse than Allison? :D

[jozza800]

MSN kloppo looks absolutely shattered in the interviews. Very fearful of a full scale collapse this season now

Yep. I thought that too, he was clearly flustered. How does he explain the last 15 minutes though!

Thought we played pretty well up until their goal. We've been knackered over the last two games due to the keeper.

We've still got a very real possibility of still finishing in the top 4. We have to keep going, Klopp has to galvanise the team somehow.

I would definitely move Hendo into midfield as a start.

[jr81]

https://mobile.twitter.com/Benxlfc/status/1360592939387412487

That looks a blatant push in fairness. But look at our players. No reaction, no one claiming for it. They should all be screaming and protesting but none of them are. There is no intensity or reaction from them

[dicko1969]

Should of been a foul 100%
Why no VAR review ?

[jr81]

Should of been a foul 100%
Why no VAR review ?

More than likely because the ref didn't flag anything to check. And with our reaction nó one seemed to think it was a foul so they probably thought everything was ok with it?

[dicko1969]

So why did VAR check the Fabinho handball of Bobby v WHU... pretty much the same time distance from foul to goal today as v WHU

What is the difference?

I'm confused... baffled ?

Also why mane offside v Everton
Today not offside ....

Key moments crucial decisions .

[jr81]

So why did VAR check the Fabinho handball of Bobby v WHU... pretty much the same time distance from foul to goal today as v WHU

What is the difference?

I'm confused... baffled ?

Also why mane offside v Everton
Today not offside ....

Key moments crucial decisions .
Dunno, maybe the ref thought something happened in the build up and asked to check to be sure in that one?

I haven't a clue, I'm just tying to throw out a suggestion.
VAR has been all over the place this year. There is no sense with it.

[skyebo]

Dunno, maybe the ref thought something happened in the build up and asked to check to be sure in that one?

I haven't a clue, I'm just tying to throw out a suggestion.
VAR has been all over the place this year. There is no sense with it.

It's been all over the place since day one and no-one will convince me that it will get better either. The ones who brought it in must be regretting it now, though they'll never admit it.

[GizmoD12]

That looks a blatant push in fairness. But look at our players. No reaction, no one claiming for it. They should all be screaming and protesting but none of them are. There is no intensity or reaction from them

Passive in play and attitude, City would have ran amok. Feeling a bit sorry for ourselves

[jr81]

Passive in play and attitude, City would have ran amok. Feeling a bit sorry for ourselves
I think so. A bit of ah poor us. That looks so blatant in that replay that even after the goal Henderson should have been straight over the ref asking for a review. Maybe he did? That replay didn't show anything.
But our aggression was not there

[jr81]

It's been all over the place since day one and no-one will convince me that it will get better either. The ones who brought it in must be regretting it now, though they'll never admit it.
Don't think so either. Look at the whole míle déan situation. Even with var he got both decisions wrong.

[eggy81]

Yep. I thought that too, he was clearly flustered. How does he explain the last 15 minutes though!

Thought we played pretty well up until their goal. We've been knackered over the last two games due to the keeper.

We've still got a very real possibility of still finishing in the top 4. We have to keep going, Klopp has to galvanise the team somehow.

I would definitely move Hendo into midfield as a start.

We need to play our strongest midfield and attack and let kabak and Philips gain some experience at the back. We utterly dominate possession in most games. Get midfield sorted and all of a sudden defence will look better too.

[jozza800]

We need to play our strongest midfield and attack and let kabak and Philips gain some experience at the back. We utterly dominate possession in most games. Get midfield sorted and all of a sudden defence will look better too.

100%

I'd be a bit annoyed if I were Phillips. I'd be knocking on Jurgen's door and asking why he isn't playing. He's looked good in all of his games.

My initial assumption is that Kabak must be a bit of a fly machine like Gomez, but he looks pretty one paced tbh.

I'm not knocking Kabak as well (before anyone starts...). I thought he had a decent debut and wasn't to blame for their 2nd. That was totally down to Ali.

[ianlfc]

Tuesday night we should see Hendo back into the midfield. I'm near sure Fabinho will be back for it and he'll partner Kabak in defence. That will be another different centre back pairing !!

[skyebo]

Tuesday night we should see Hendo back into the midfield. I'm near sure Fabinho will be back for it and he'll partner Kabak in defence. That will be another different centre back pairing !!

Fabinho should be back, he was suspended for today for reaching 5 bookings. Yeah, we've only had 14 up to now.

[Kev0909]

Fabinho should be back, he was suspended for today for reaching 5 bookings. Yeah, we've only had 14 up to now.

No he's injured again rushed back v man city

[justme]

I see that bald headed snake Pep as been gloating saying of course LFC can win the league.. I hope the owners are watching this..
They need to contact Klopp and makes sure hes ok first and foremost and make it clear we all care for about him
I dont believe any of the crappy rumours he has walked.. He will be back for a fight soon :)

[skyebo]

No he's injured again rushed back v man city

Oh right, but wouldn't he have missed today anyway. When he got booked recently, it shown that it was his 5th.

[Kev0909]

Oh right, but wouldn't he have missed today anyway. When he got booked recently, it shown that it was his 5th.

is there a rule after a certain number of games it resets?

I don't really know

[LEGS]

is there a rule after a certain number of games it resets?

I don't really know

You are correct after a certain date you need 10 bookings

[Kev0909]

You are correct after a certain date you need 10 bookings

I assume it's half-way

[LEGS]

I assume it's half-way

Something like that boss

[Nineteenx]

[video=youtube_share;aZKbW8L3O-8]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aZKbW8L3O-8]

[Nineteenx]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aZKbW8L3O-8

Watch from 18 seconds, pay particular attention, can anyone tell me what was wrong?

[CCTV]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aZKbW8L3O-8

Watch from 18 seconds, pay particular attention, can anyone tell me what was wrong?

Copyright infringement

[Kev0909]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aZKbW8L3O-8

Watch from 18 seconds, pay particular attention, can anyone tell me what was wrong?

What's your point ?

A number of things went wrong there, Wij nowhere near man... gomez Robertson being the main one.....

@CCTV can't play on forum have to go on youtube / link click title

[CCTV]

Cheers kev

[Insidious]

It's such a shame that we aren't functioning in either box at the moment.

If we were looking defensively solid (ha!) we could consider conceding possession, sitting in and trying to hit other sides on the break, as something HAS to change and pronto - but that doesn't look an option at present.

[CCTV]

It's such a shame that we aren't functioning in either box at the moment.

If we were looking defensively solid (ha!) we could consider conceding possession, sitting in and trying to hit other sides on the break, as something HAS to change and pronto - but that doesn't look an option at present.

That's what we did second half v Leipzig in the main, only reverting back to type when 2-0 up somewhat.

The system has to adapt to the players available.

Today, I didn't have the best stream but a clearance from defense to one of our wide forwards up the pitch didnt seem to be on the menu.

Lots of passing around at the back instead and hendo injured dribbling out of defence, could have hoofed it up the pitch and possibly prevented his injury.

No desire to beat the press by going over it. Instead an insistence in overpaying the ball.

[CCTV]

It's like we wont do what we've hated other teams doing to us.

[jozza800]

Might help if he'd play defenders in defence and midfielders in midfield. Round pegs and all that. I'd have told Klopp to get fuckes if I'd been Nat Phillips. He's been treated awfully this last few months. He's not put a foot wrong when called upon. Kabak has come straight into the side.

[Kev0909]

Might help if he'd play defenders in defence and midfielders in midfield. Round pegs and all that. I'd have told Klopp to get fuckes if I'd been Nat Phillips. He's been treated awfully this last few months. He's not put a foot wrong when called upon. Kabak has come straight into the side.

yep

why sign davies?? phillips is gonna be let go at end of season, as no contract

Joke

[Insidious]

Today, I didn't have the best stream but a clearance from defense to one of our wide forwards up the pitch didnt seem to be on the menu.

Lots of passing around at the back instead and hendo injured dribbling out of defence, could have hoofed it up the pitch and possibly prevented his injury.



I think a couple of early miscues in the match due to the wind put our players off trying it much, due to fear of losing the ball. However, you either have to adapt your technique to compensate or you have to be better at the alternative - the floor game - where we were poor today - Everton had to deal with the wind too so we can't use it as an excuse. Just have to adjust.

I was "happy enough" for a 10-minute spell of the second half of that match - we were moving the ball more quickly and it would arrive at the recipient with a bit of zip on it - but the rest of the game was poor and there's no excuse for that.

A lot of frustrated Reds tonight and rightly so.

[miller0863]

Twice in recent games we’ve had a CB go off injured during a game. The constant changes to the CB pairing is killing us

[ianlfc]

Twice in recent games we’ve had a CB go off injured during a game. The constant changes to the CB pairing is killing us

the 18th centre back pairing this season. But we've been the worst Champions ever !!

[jozza800]

If he'd stop playing midfielders at the back we might not be in this situation.

[jozza800]

What I would say is that it's clear that there isn't an obvious answer or reason to our form. Firmino, Mane, Salah Wij, TTA, Ali, Klopp, the owners, injuries, officials, VAR have all come under fire at some point (or most) of the season.

[eggy81]

What I would say is that it's clear that there isn't an obvious answer or reason to our form. Firmino, Mane, Salah Wij, TTA, Ali, Klopp, the owners, injuries, officials, VAR have all come under fire at some point (or most) of the season.

The fact that with injuries having worked out as they have the players we let go particularly lallana and lovren would have been extremely useful and arguably a lot better than what we have been left with is all the more sickening

[CCTV]

Eggy, odds on Lallanas out injured if he was here :D

[eggy81]

Eggy, odds on Lallanas out injured if he was here :D

Ha yeah more than likely. Think he’s been out twice for Brighton already.

[skyebo]

Ha yeah more than likely. Think he’s been out twice for Brighton already.

We've still got a few BUPA sponsored players to get shut of, it won't be easy though because no-one wants players who spend more time in the physio room than on the pitch. They are literally stealing a living from the club.

[eggy81]

We need 2.3 points per remaining game to reach 70 points to get 4th by my calculations. If West Ham continue at current rate of point scoring they will hit 68 points. Worryingly that’s title winning form for this season stretched out over the full season. Over 38 games it would bring us to 87 points. Tall order.

[Nineteenx]

We need 2.3 points per remaining game to reach 70 points to get 4th by my calculations. If West Ham continue at current rate of point scoring they will hit 68 points. Worryingly that’s title winning form for this season stretched out over the full season. Over 38 games it would bring us to 87 points. Tall order.

Doubt we'll get fourth, need to make sure we keep our mentality, don't let the prem officiating bollocks affect us and always concentrate on the positives and are bouyant and super energised and intense every time we set foot on the pitch in Champions League games in the expectation of something resembling a level playing field

[dicko1969]

Doubt we'll get fourth, need to make sure we keep our mentality, don't let the prem officiating bollocks affect us and always concentrate on the positives and are bouyant and super energised and intense every time we set foot on the pitch in Champions League games in the expectation of something resembling a level playing field

Yesterday
Really a penalty.
That ref looked once at the replay
Happy to give it rapid.
Same muppet as Goodison and vvd.

Their goal not even var checked.

If we scored they fine comb it back to the kick off !! Haha

[Nineteenx]

Yesterday
Really a penalty.
That ref looked once at the replay
Happy to give it rapid.
Same muppet as Goodison and vvd.

Their goal not even var checked.

If we scored they fine comb it back to the kick off !! Haha

He didn't even watch the full replay once, the cunt was on camera and the replay he was watching didn't show the angle from the side that showed is was no way on earth a foul, but a blatant dive, maybe down to that bent cunt Marriner doing the VAR and selecting which imagery he got to view, although in truth, he very obviously wasn't interested in viewing it at all

[teesred]

He couldn't wait to give it, he'd made his mind up. Only looked at the replay because he was told to.

[Insidious]

The last crumb of comfort for me for our League season (and it really is a crumb) is that we have a decent number of games in the latter stages against sides who won't be competing for Top Four, nor fighting to save themselves from relegation.

But realistically, given that we can't seem to buy a point right now, it feels like we're looking at the Lottery aspect of the Champion's League, with the bits of luck, moments of inspiration and improved standard of refereeing that we might pull off something wonderful at the last.

Can't pretend I'm in any way confident in that regard right now, but we were much poorer (on paper) than Juventus, Chelsea and AC Milan in '05 yet still managed, with Di Matteo's Chelsea also having been far from the favourites the year they won it.

We'd need to start getting some results though to give ourselves some self-belief. The second leg against Leipzig isn't a guarantee despite our huge advantage in the tie.

[scientificred]

We won that 2095 CL final with a team I fondly refer to as a team of duds and crocks.
Our serious injuries that season were huge - probably far greater than this.
Here's hoping Sid!

[faridtoxteth]

The last crumb of comfort for me for our League season (and it really is a crumb) is that we have a decent number of games in the latter stages against sides who won't be competing for Top Four, nor fighting to save themselves from relegation.

But realistically, given that we can't seem to buy a point right now, it feels like we're looking at the Lottery aspect of the Champion's League, with the bits of luck, moments of inspiration and improved standard of refereeing that we might pull off something wonderful at the last.

Can't pretend I'm in any way confident in that regard right now, but we were much poorer (on paper) than Juventus, Chelsea and AC Milan in '05 yet still managed, with Di Matteo's Chelsea also having been far from the favourites the year they won it.

We'd need to start getting some results though to give ourselves some self-belief. The second leg against Leipzig isn't a guarantee despite our huge advantage in the tie.

Its true we didn't have a good team on paper in 05, and if you look at that AC Milan team, right the way through it just world class players. But we did have two very tough central defenders and it was because of them we came through that away game nil nil at Juventus, without Gerrard in the team, and managed to get through to the next round.
Wish we had those two at the back now.
If by some miracle fans can get back into games before the end of the season that would help us massively.

[eggy81]

We won that 2095 CL final with a team I fondly refer to as a team of duds and crocks.
Our serious injuries that season were huge - probably far greater than this.
Here's hoping Sid!
Ah but that team had a great spine. Well apart from up front.

[Insidious]

Ah but that team had a great spine. Well apart from up front.

Quality is relative though, isn't it? Juventus, Chelsea and AC Milan all had better sides and probably better spines - at goalkeeper for example most would agree that over the course of a season Cech and Buffon were better keepers than Dudek, much as I don't want to belittle his heroics throughout our campaign.

It's similar to when people talk of England's "Golden Generation" not doing enough, when some of the other sides in World Football, such as Brazil, were simply better.

You'd always give us a chance in Europe, though we'd all concede that we lose a LOT without the cacophony of noise that is a packed Anfield.

People can say "ah, but all sides are missing fans" but I think it's definitely different for certain teams - I'm not sure Ole would have lasted through the boos (that didn't happen!) earlier this season for example - and City are so devoid of a Soul I'd almost wager a lack of fans suits them!

[stevie harkness]

We won that 2095 CL final with a team I fondly refer to as a team of duds and crocks.
Our serious injuries that season were huge - probably far greater than this.
Here's hoping Sid!

Thanks for the tip McFly!

[skyebo]

Thanks for the tip McFly!

Haha, i don't think he realised what he said.

[TheDOC1979]

Thanks for the tip McFly!

Guess the Almanac didn't talk about match fixing...

[Insidious]

Just remembering little bits of that campaign. You always need a little luck to win and one of the matches that gets overlooked due to the scoreline is the 0-0 against Juventus.

1-0 would have been enough for them that night to take them through. First half Ibrahimovic puts a volley over the bar from about 7 or 8 yards out, second half a Cannavaro header hits the post.

Such are the fine margins in Footballing history sometimes. That was the Tournament where we set a precedent for the winners being allowed to compete the next season if they had missed out via League qualification (we had finished 5th) and we could theoretically have not been in the Champion's League for 05/06 and thus reduced capacity for squad improvement etc etc.

It's funny how these things pan out and thankfully 04/05 panned out the way it did as we have some wonderful memories for life. Even thinking back to that recent semi-final against Barca, they so nearly had a 4th goal in that first leg and it can be argued that the ball NOT going in was the tiny psychological thread of light we needed to think a Miracle may be possible in the second leg.

Football's bloody wonderful like that sometimes, much as we've been dealt a dreadful hand this time around.

[scientificred]

Haha, i don't think he realised what he said.
The gift of foresight!
I acknowledge my error!

[Insidious]

Really hope (against Sheffield United and Fulham anyway) we sit off a little bit for spells.

No matter how disciplined, opposition sides eventually get a bit frustrated, someone breaks rank and pushes onto you when you have the ball and there's a Domino effect.

We desperately need more counter-attacking opportunities and clear-cut chances (45 shots converted of 493...) and I think dropping the back line 5 or 10 yards and to try and invite some sides onto us is a way you can tweak things without trying to rip the script up.

[teesred]

Utd have Chelsea and City in the next few games. We could be 3 points behind them.........or 15 more likely. Lolz etc.

[Insidious]

Utd have Chelsea and City in the next few games. We could be 3 points behind them.........or 15 more likely. Lolz etc.

We're at the Precipice at the moment really.

The opportunities to get closer to sides above us will be there, but we haven't been able to take the chances.

You look at our next 4 matches - two relegation zone sides, a Top Four rival with a new Manager and a Champion's League 2nd leg and it's either where we recover something for the season, or it utterly sinks.

So many "6-pointers" will occur in the final 13 matches but we have to actually put points on the Board. Sheffield United is a huge game and Chelsea will arguably be our biggest League game of the season.

[Nineteenx]

Relax top four and No7 is absolutely nailed on, get the win v Sheffield UTD then Jota's back for the Chelsea game onwards, put him in for Bobby and we'll be scoring for fun taking matters out of VARs hands and finish the season with a run of 19 back to back victories and No7

[Steveo]

You almost sound a little worried?

[dicko1969]

The hope is that the champions league is something different. 2 legs and different mind set.
Hopefully the players see it like that.

Some players now need to show leadership.

Salah Mane Robertson Gini Thiago Bobby.

All masses of experience in Europe and world football.

I cant see anyone apart Bayern.
They are peaking. Season 2 of the 4 year cycle.

Pity we dont have supporters that can make such as difference. All is possible.

But I doubt if we get through that we wont go any further than 1/4s.

I felt more confident 3-0 down v Barcelona.
The team then was at its peak.

Tonight was so good to watch two open teams playing football.

Leeds v Southampton.

Liverpool games are so frustrating when teams just park the bus. And liverpool pass from side to side because there is literally no space to slice into.

[Nineteenx]

The hope is that the champions league is something different. 2 legs and different mind set.
Hopefully the players see it like that.

Some players now need to show leadership.

Salah Mane Robertson Gini Thiago Bobby.

All masses of experience in Europe and world football.

I cant see anyone apart Bayern.
They are peaking. Season 2 of the 4 year cycle.

Pity we dont have supporters that can make such as difference. All is possible.

But I doubt if we get through that we wont go any further than 1/4s.

I felt more confident 3-0 down v Barcelona.
The team then was at its peak.

Tonight was so good to watch two open teams playing football.

Leeds v Southampton.

Liverpool games are so frustrating when teams just park the bus. And liverpool pass from side to side because there is literally no space to slice into.

We didn't have any problems last season or the season before, the difference is we have been trying to pass through this season rather than creating overloads by condensing the play and players into an area, usually our right, before switching right to left to find Mane and Robbo and Bobby or a midfielder in more time and space on our left, with good options to release any of the 3 wide or through the channel and to cross, put low balls or through balls in to players coming in from the right That is the fundamental difference between our beating PTB teams the last 2 seasons and struggling with them this

We never had the midfielders to pick the lock, so we used to smash the door down with a sledge hammer, we still don't have the midfielders to pick the lock, so I have absolutely no idea why we started trying to do that instead of what worked

[Steveo]

So your tactic is to keep on with the same tactic that stopped working a year ago?

It broke down mainly due to the natural ageing process accelerated by fatigue/burn out all compounded by asking too much of too few.

At some point you have to accept that the human body and mind are both fallible - they weaken over time.

[Steveo]

Even this prized plum called it a year back.

https://tribuna.com/en/liverpoolfc/news/2020-03-13-exred-mcateer-on-liverpools-latest-form-this-is-burnout-and-klopp-needs-to-address-it/

And yes Klopp has to shoulder some of the blame, but we know the style of play... and it required surgery in summer 2019 to avoid that crash by the following February!

[Steveo]

FFS

Diogo Jota moment changed Liverpool's season and forward now under pressure to save it



https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/diogo-jota-liverpool-moment-breaking-19902832

[Nineteenx]

So your tactic is to keep on with the same tactic that stopped working a year ago?

It broke down mainly due to the natural ageing process accelerated by fatigue/burn out all compounded by asking too much of too few.

At some point you have to accept that the human body and mind are both fallible - they weaken over time.

Jesus wept man, go and look at the youtube of all our Premier League goals of last season and from the start of this stopped working a year ago :D fucking hell, at least have something to back your statements up with, there is no evidence from any of last season's highlights or from the start of this season that how we played and broke teams down stopped working at all, all the actual evidence of the goals we've scored and even the ones during this lean spell have come through doing the things we are best at

I take issue with the know nothings that talk about burn out and fatigue, they are entirely bereft of any reasoned logical thinking

Let's have a look at the obvious logistical aspect of how we played

Play condensed in the opposition half most of most games - Shorter runs, less long sprints, amazing energy saving of a fluid midfield 3 in the amount of running and sprints each player has to do

You tell me Steveo, what other way of playing, conserves energy and reduces fatigue better than this? It's something of a rhetorical question, because anyone reading it, with even the most basic processes of logical reasoning can very easily understand how we played actually counters fatigue and saves players legs, exactly the opposite to what all the numpties say, because they are entirely unable to understand and comprehend simply basic logistics

Playing most of all games almost exclusively in one half of the pitch making shorter runs, the midfield 3 being fluid and assuming each others positions and covering them, so a player who has gone on a high press doesn't have to make a 20-30 yard sprint back after a player released behind him as he would if playing a fixed position (see Hendo's hamstring injury v Atletico when we changed that and Fab not covering behind him as any of the 3 did in his absence). The forwards being able to stay high, making mostly 10-15 yard sprints and not having to make the sort of full length of the pitch sprints back to defend they have been having to do in our recent games. The full backs supported to play higher, again not having to run and sprint as far as frequently in both directions - STEVEO - how we played are all things that dramatically reduce fatigue, how we're playing now dramatically increases it - SURELY, for the love of God you can see that?

The evidence of this season from the start until we changed is very clear, what we were doing and had been doing worked, still worked and the results clearly showed that, changing to try and play through teams didn't work, if you think I'm wrong, show me 2 or 3 goals where we played through teams, I won't hold my breath because there aren't any.

Because you stop doing something that all the evidence shows was still working isn't it stopping working, it's you stopping doing it and THAT is the truth of what has happened, the performances and results clearly show that, the amount of longer sprints our players are having to do which are infinitely more fatiguing show that

Let's talk about Jota's headed goal assisted by Mane, maybe go and look at the youtube of it, in that game we absolutely stank the place our, we created virtually nothing, and we weren't playing as we had been playing. For whatever reason, personally I have no idea whatsoever what the thinknig behind it was or why it was deemed necessary, when Jurgen played Jota at No9, rather than Mane and Mo keep the width and make their runs in behind and be a foil for Robbo and Trent, they had very clearly been asked to not do that and make different runs and play narrower. This was the start of the forward/full backs automation and relationships that were one of our greatest strengths breaking down and becoming ineffective, NOT through playing the same, but through playing differently, with no good reason, we hadn't encountered any problems with scoring goals prior to that

All game in that match thread I was moaning Mane was not making his usual runs or in his usual positions and when Robbo got possession in advanced positions he had no-one to link with. For Jota's goal, contrary to how he had been asked to play and where he had been asked to play, having not done that the entire game, Mane assumed his usual position and started to make his usual runs in a 5 minute period, and hey presto, Mr Ben style, he was released in space, I think by Robbo, in was of the only instances that entire game he was where Robbo would usually find him, and crossed for Jota to score

Stopped working :D :D

look at our 3 or 4 best chances in this lean spell, all missed somewhat inexplicably, ooh all except one, that one being Mane being released with a ball down the line to tee Mo up, all of them, from balls played forward early, from Hendo at CB one for Mane, 3 for Mo, to released them behind a defence on the edge of their own area

[Nineteenx]

So your tactic is to keep on with the same tactic that stopped working a year ago?

It broke down mainly due to the natural ageing process accelerated by fatigue/burn out all compounded by asking too much of too few.

At some point you have to accept that the human body and mind are both fallible - they weaken over time.

Absolute nonsense Steveo, read my lengthy post and explain to me, based on how we did play, what other we of playing we could adopt that was as incredibly faituge and energy saving as the way we were playing

[Nineteenx]

FFS

Diogo Jota moment changed Liverpool's season and forward now under pressure to save it



https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/diogo-jota-liverpool-moment-breaking-19902832

Another example of poor journalism from the Echo, there's precious little wonder when I did my world cup site I absolutely wiped the floor with long established football writers, because they understand the game about as well as most referees, it's just nostalgic aspirational fairy tale telling that is a million miles away from what actually happened, if you actually understand football and what made our side so formidable, the same as writing about fatigue and burn out of a team who were playing in a way that allowed them to conserve energy and suffer as little fatigue as possible, then they'd realise they were writing jibberish

[Steveo]

Absolute nonsense Steveo, read my lengthy post and explain to me, based on how we did play, what other we of playing we could adopt that was as incredibly faituge and energy saving as the way we were playing

Not 100% sure what you mean here.

You seem to be asking what other way we needed to play..?

That is not what I am talking about. The template could have been left alone but you need more players to keep such a high intensity game going without the inevitable drop in performance. We cannot forget that this breakdown has arisen despite bumming off all domestic cups.

You need to be able to rotate players which Klopp clearly has not been able to do.

[Kev0909]

19X will only slag him off when he misses a few chances, unlike his beloved bobby it's unacceptable for Jota to miss anything

like before he got injured stupid prick

he's not even a number 9 his goal record at wolves wasn't the best, I don't expect him to score a stupid amount, more than bobby though

[Steveo]

Think the poor fella has issues.

[Nineteenx]

Now, when Jota returns I expect him to score goals, I rate Jota more highly than anyone else on this forum, I spent 2 years watching as many Wolves games that didn't clash with our for that reason, he is a more clinical and better finisher than Bobby, without any doubt whatsoever

But, re the fairytale, changing things, so many things when bringing Jota in is the reason we lost our form and automation and ability to do things as quickly and as well as we did, people take my comments on such things entirely the wrong way, that is in no way shape or form a dig at Jota, love the guy brilliant player, but Jurgen and the coaching staff really shouldn't have changed those things and so devastatingly broke down aspects of our play and the automation of it that were so devastatingly effective when introducing Diogo, it was absolutely needless and uneccesary, especially as bar that Atlanta game which was definitely a 3 up top with Mane and Mo taking different positions and making different runs, it patently hasn't worked and most of Jota's goals came through passages of play from the team playing from muscle memory and reverting to what had always worked for them.

It's the same with Fab, it isn't a slight on Fab, he doesn't play in a way that supports the fluid midfield 3 that was our best midfield we've had since Jurgen arrived in his absence, that's not Fab's fault, I know how he plays. what his strong points are and what his limitations are, the same as with most of our players, the point was always given there was an evolution in his absence, Jurgen shouldn't have brought him back in until the coaching staff had worked with him so he could slot in like clockwork into a fluid midfield 3, both things aren't digs at the player, they are more digs at Jurgen and the coaching staff over what I view as very bad errors

I've watched Jota for 2 years prior to him coming here, having done that, in my mind there is absolutely no question whatsoever that the changes Jurgen made to what Mane and Mo did, which had a hugely negative effect on Mane and Robbo's form in particular, were entirely unecessary and it is those changes that have buggered everything else up

Listen to the players

As detailed, I've always spent considerable time watching other people and listening to their conversations and studying other people like you're an alien species, I am incredibly astute and very sharp and quick to spot things and pick up on things, and in his recent Sky interview Trent completely gave the game away, it wasn't meant, it wasn't a dig in any way shape of form, just an exceptional young lad being candid and open and less guarded in interview

Interviewer "Would you say you changed things since last season"

Trent "Yeah, we've change quite a lot, probably too much"

Tells it's own story Steveo, straight from the horses mouth, things have been, were changed that he obviously didn't think helped or worked as well

[Nineteenx]

Not 100% sure what you mean here.

You seem to be asking what other way we needed to play..?

That is not what I am talking about. The template could have been left alone but you need more players to keep such a high intensity game going without the inevitable drop in performance. We cannot forget that this breakdown has arisen despite bumming off all domestic cups.

You need to be able to rotate players which Klopp clearly has not been able to do.

That makes no sense Steveo, other teams do it, without having to constantly chop and change and out of all teams, our way of playing was the most fatigue reducing and protecting, which is why we were able to play at the levels we did so consistently

[Steveo]

That makes no sense Steveo, other teams do it, without having to constantly chop and change and out of all teams, our way of playing was the most fatigue reducing and protecting, which is why we were able to play at the levels we did so consistently

Other teams do indeed do it - and they do it with bigger squads.


But keep trying

[Nineteenx]

19X will only slag him off when he misses a few chances, unlike his beloved bobby it's unacceptable for Jota to miss anything

like before he got injured stupid prick

he's not even a number 9 his goal record at wolves wasn't the best, I don't expect him to score a stupid amount, more than bobby though

I won't be slating Jota at all, I love the guy, he is a miles more clinical finisher than Bobby, absolutely no doubt or question about it, I was never slating Jota as you lot perceived it in the first place, I was bemoaning the completely unecessary changes Jurgen and the coaching staff made to what the other forwards did and how that affected our full backs and everything else when they brought him in, there was absolutely no need to do that and it is that that has caused so much of what we did brilliantly for 3 seasons to break down, that's not on Jota, it's on Jurgen and the coaching staff

[Nineteenx]

Other teams do indeed do it - and they do it with bigger squads.


But keep trying

City only change one or two most games and quite often none despite their massive squad, there are numerous players who for 3 seasons barely ever played, Sterling and a few others play virtually every game, in all competitions, League, Champions League, FA Cup and Carabao Cup, even in this fixture congested season of madness

But keep trying

[justme]

Can I ask an important question? why does Nineteenx type out dozens of paragraphs in one post that no one reads??
They are too long and no doubt still bullshit.

[Nineteenx]

Can I ask an important question? why does Nineteenx type out dozens of paragraphs in one post that no one reads??
They are too long and no doubt still bullshit.

Reading and comprehending them takes a certain degree of intelligence, target audience perhaps? With social media the majority people have lost the ability of reading and comprehension and the attention span for anything over the 200 words they use on Twitter, sadly true

[scientificred]

Reading and comprehending them takes a certain degree of intelligence, target audience perhaps? With social media the majority people have lost the ability of reading and comprehension and the attention span for anything over the 200 words they use on Twitter, sadly true
Certainly not more than 200 words 19x.
I like your long posts but if anything they could do with breaking up in to more paragraphs

[Kev0909]

Can I ask an important question? why does Nineteenx type out dozens of paragraphs in one post that no one reads??
They are too long and no doubt still bullshit.

Sometimes interesting

Sometimes lies (if aimed at another forum poster you said this and that proved many of times to be bullshit)

Sometimes the same shit in 4-6 different topics about the same time

I real mix bag.

[Nineteenx]

Certainly not more than 200 words 19x.
I like your long posts but if anything they could do with breaking up in to more paragraphs

Thank you, when I first joined this forum such long and detailed posts were common place, people wrote their thoughts in detail, most posters took the time to read them, and people replied in detail, putting forward their own arguments or raising further points on an aspect of the post they had read they felt the poster may have overlooked and adding to the discussion of that aspect

[scientificred]

I think Justin knows the truth between you two