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Thread: European Superleague teams to be announced today

  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crimson Dynasty View Post
    Honest question :

    Do you believe US owners are better than /worse/just about the same as....

    - Middle Eastern Oil Sheikhs
    - Russian Oil Barons and Oligarchs

    Because let's be honest here, the rot was already in the game before the Yanks came into the scene.

    They just saw that others were making out like robbers and bandits and decided to get in on the action.
    I think the difference is purely down to national sports.

    I canít stand the fact that certain clubs are state owned - the petrodollar clubs are a joke IMO but they are owned by people from nations that are football mad. These people are involved at least at some level due to a love of the Sport.

    The Russian Oil barons - more gas and metal in truth but they are also from a nation where football is king:

    Roman Abramovic has no interest in profit - he wants to own a football club and make it a success.. Simples.

    My issue with US ownership of any football club is just that. Ownership purely based on profit. Or based on raising the profile of the owner.

    There is no love of the sport - barely any understanding at all in fact. Football as we call it - soccer - as it is called in the US is almost an irrelevance.


    A football club like Liverpool or Aston Villa - or Newcastle - or any club you choose to mention, is part of the fabric of a community. Most are well over 100 years old. To hand that over to predatory forces - well itís crazy. IMO. And it has led to this point.


    Hereís an example in reverse.

    If I was living in the US - I wouldnít be happy about a British individual or business buying a Baseball/ Basketball or American football club. We just donít play the sports over here - or in the case of Basketball not to any level close to the US. What would we be bringing to the table except ignorance and a penchant for profit?
    Last edited by Steveo; 18th April 2021 at 11:43 PM.

  2. #62
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    FYI everyone.

    Manchester United co-chairman Joel Glazer will be a vice-chairman of the Super League.

  3. #63
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    Excellent, so the totally impartial co-chairman of Manchester Utd Joel Glazer, will be a Vice Chairman of this new Super league?
    Seems perfectly fair.


    ďArsenal, Chelsea, Liverpool, Manchester City, Manchester United and Tottenham are among 12 clubs who have agreed to join a new European Super League (ESL).

    In a seismic move for European football, the Premier League clubs will join AC Milan, Atletico Madrid, Barcelona, Inter Milan, Juventus and Real Madrid.

    The ESL said the founding clubs had agreed to establish a "new midweek competition" and that the inaugural season "is intended to commence as soon as practicable".

    It also "anticipated that a further three clubs will join" the breakaway.

    Manchester United co-chairman Joel Glazer will be a vice-chairman of the Super League.

    He said: "By bringing together the world's greatest clubs and players to play each other throughout the season, the Super League will open a new chapter for European football, ensuring world-class competition and facilities, and increased financial support for the wider football pyramid."

    UK Prime Minister Boris Johnson, Uefa and the Premier League condemned the move when news of it broke on Sunday.Ē

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steveo View Post
    I think the difference is purely down to national sports.

    I canít stand the fact that certain clubs are state owned - the petrodollar clubs are a joke IMO but they are owned by people from nations that are football mad. These people are involved at least at some level due to a love of the Sport.

    The Russian Oil barons - more gas and metal in truth but they are also from a nation where football is king:

    Roman Abramovic has no interest in profit - he wants to own a football club and make it a success.. Simples.

    My issue with US ownership of any football club is just that. Ownership purely based on profit. Or based on raising the profile of the owner.

    There is no love of the sport - barely any understanding at all in fact. Football as we call it - soccer - as it is called in the US is almost an irrelevance.

    A football club like Liverpool or Aston Villa - or Newcastle - or any club you choose to mention, is part of the fabric of a community. Most are well over 100 years old. To hand that over to predatory forces - well itís crazy. IMO. And it has led to this point.
    I see.

    Although I think there's a level of delusion or at least naivete if you truly believe that these Oil Sheikhs (and Russian Oil Barons) own these clubs because of,....."love of the game"

    Roman bought Chelsea because it was another offshore investment for him, where he could park some of those ill-gotten billions of rubbles he's "appropriated" from Russian people like his fellow Putin-buddy Oligarchs.
    It's no different than when Chinese billionaires park their millions and billions in Swiss villas and mansions in the Caribbean.

    It might be a bit different with the Middle Eastern state owned petro Barons, but with them its more of a status and ego thing than anything to do with love of the game.
    They don't care about the football community in Manchester or East London or Paris.
    Otherwise why choose those (coincidentally) large cities with great football histories in which to buy clubs and not the Aston Villas and the Newcastles as you pointed out?

    At least the Americans are openly more honest (more or less) about their motives to make money and profit, and to the extent that the club succeeds, they get what they want out of their investment, and are not just pouring money down a drain on a toy until they get bored of it and fling it over their shoulder like a bratty child when they're done.

    The idea that there's a billionaire (or a bunch of them) out there who's a true dyed-in-the-wool blood red true football fan and member of his community type that will buy your club and whose motives will only be for pure love of the game and the club,......is....frankly speaking, delusional.
    They don't exist.
    You're more likely to find the Tooth fairy or Santa Claus.

    So why we would hold modern owners that that as a standard of expectation, is beyond me.

    I know the devil that FSG are.
    I also know the angels that Roman and the Sheikhs are not.
    At least FSG didn't come to their billions by virtue of their proximity to centers of power in their country that are responsible for violating all manner of human rights, so in that sense there's a little bit more cleanliness in conscience than from being owned by "Oil Baron money"....coming from places where they literally still have human slavery, or places where opponents of your buddy Putin are poisoned or thrown into prison to be killed slowly for good measure.

    But that's just me.
    Last edited by Crimson Dynasty; 18th April 2021 at 11:53 PM.
    To be precise it's only a portion of me downloaded via satellite.
    This Gynoid's E-brain lacks.........capacity.

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steveo View Post
    FYI everyone.

    Manchester United co-chairman Joel Glazer will be a vice-chairman of the Super League.
    All of the big 6 clubs owners will be (co-)vice-chairmen of the Super League, with what I imagine will be a rotating voted upon Chairmanship.

    So John Henry will be a vice-chairman as well, as will Levy, as will Kroenke, Roman, Mansour....etc.
    To be precise it's only a portion of me downloaded via satellite.
    This Gynoid's E-brain lacks.........capacity.

  6. #66

  7. #67
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    @ Crimson - I really donít agree.

    What Human rights is Roman Abramovic responsible for BTW? And no nation in the Middle East has as much blood on its hands as Uncle Sam..! While we are at it - Stop being friends with that disgusting Saudi...!

    How has Romans fortune been less nobly earned than John W Henryís? Because he made far more? Or is it because he was Russian? Because you believe all the stories? Seriously? We know he is shady as fuck and profited big time from the break up of the Soviet Union - but that was due to the US and their chum Yeltsin..!
    Are you telling me those Glazers are a nice bunch of chaps?? Come on .

    These guys all made their money at someone elseís expense - That is how it works. BUT in a football sense the Russians and the Arabs are putting far more back into their clubs than the Americans ever do. They seem happy to pile up debt OR to make the club self sufficient ( no cost from the investor ) in readiness for a big fat sale. OR as we now see the huge cash cow generation of a European league all pushed for by the very same people. the people who donít care about football beyond itís money generation capability. They are destroying the sport.

    I reject that your FSG folk are better than Roman - maybe more benign as individuals but not for Liverpool FC - I say they are worse for our club - and they and their ilk are MUCH MUCH worse for the sport.

    I appreciate that my views on American ownership of Football clubs isnít an easy swallow for an American BUT I am right. US investment in British football is like a cancer and it is spreading.
    Last edited by Steveo; 19th April 2021 at 12:14 AM.

  8. #68
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    Itís a whole new ball game eh mr murdoch!

    best news iíve heard today.

    the game is on itís way to being the sporting spectacle it was supposed to be.

    no more dodgy var
    no more corrupt pmgol
    no more ffp joke rules
    no more being shafted

    this is much bigger than the purile infantile sobs of a gary neville who embarrassingly fought for his £4m a year SKY salary.

    iím sure if murdoch won the tv rights gary, youíd be singing a different tune right!

    90% of those myopic individuals who have completely missed the point of the ESL will be running to it in a year. children.

    oh yeh, justmoi and high waist boy you can fuck off too!

  9. #69
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    Champions and europa league suspended apparently?

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steveo View Post
    @ Crimson - I really donít agree.

    What Human rights is Roman Abramovic responsible for BTW? And no nation in the Middle East has as much blood on its hands as Uncle Sam..! While we are at it - Stop being friends with that disgusting Saudi...!
    Come on Steveo, you CAN"T possibly be this naive.
    And hypocritical.

    You can't on the one hand cover your eyes to the fact that the vast majority of Roman's wealth has come courtesy of his friendship and proximity to Putin (And all that entails), while at the same time trying to conflate how FSG made their fortune, with what the American government has done historically(especially in terms of their foreign policy which you clearly disagree with),.....as if they either had a say or influence in any of that - most of which happened long before they even existed as a company.

    'Guilt by association for thee (FSG), but complete river of denial for me (Roman)'.

    FSG didn't make their fortune because they were friends with a particular American president or administration, or because they poured millions of lobbying money to get legislation and laws passed to their benefit.
    You can't say the same about Roman's fortune.


    Quote Originally Posted by Steveo View Post
    How has Romans fortune been less nobly earned than John W Henryís? Because he made far more? Or is it because he was Russian? Because you believe all the stories? Seriously? We know he is shady as fuck and profited big time from the break up of the Soviet Union - but that was due to the US and their chum Yeltsin..!
    So Americans are responsible for Roman's fortune as well.
    That is hilarious.
    They're just the regular Father Christmases handing out billion dolla/rubble fortunes left and right.

    And Putin - Roman's good friend and buddy - is innocent in all this, right?

    Good grief!

    And in answer to your question as to whether Putin's buddy, Roman's fortune was less nobly earned than FSG, let me check with Navalny on that and I'll get back to you sharp-ish.


    Quote Originally Posted by Steveo View Post
    Are you telling me those Glazers are a nice bunch of chaps?? Come on.
    I never said that.
    But you also know for a fact that as despicable as you find them (mostly on account of the fact that they own the Mancs), they're not on the same level of corruptness and overall shittiness as the likes of Roman or the other Oil Barons.

    You KNOW this!
    And you're just playing this moral equivalency game trying to paint people you know are terrible human beings as good just so you can paint others as being as bad as them when you know it isn't the case at all.

    Roman Abramovich can't even set foot on British soil much less his own home country's soil, that he's forced to take up Israeli citizenship just to have a place to set roots on.

    That's just how much of a problematic individual he is.

    But sure, FSG are CLEARLY the bad guys here.
    And the Glazers.

    Clearly.

    Quote Originally Posted by Steveo View Post
    These guys all made their money at someone elseís expense - That is how it works.
    So slavery is ok?
    Torture and abuse and outright assassination of political enemies is fine?

    Good to know.

    Because that's how a lot of these guys that you're now trying to excuse or paint in a better light came upon their fortunes - either directly or because someone they knew well was doing that to other people, while they benefitted from that relationship and proximity to that center of power.

    I'm pretty certain that neither FSG nor even the Glazers came upon their fortunes because they are friends or have friends in high political offices where they sanction the poisoning of political critics or they practically sanction the abuse and slavery of people in their own countries

    Quote Originally Posted by Steveo View Post
    BUT in a football sense the Russians and the Arabs are putting far more back into their clubs than the Americans ever do. They seem happy to pile up debt OR to make the club self sufficient ( no cost from the investor ) in readiness for a big fat sale. OR as we now see the huge cash cow generation of a European league all pushed for by the very same people. the people who donít care about football beyond itís money generation capability. They are destroying the sport.
    Excuse me, but what's the big sin with FSG making Liverpool be more self-sufficient - even if it's to make us ready for a big sale?

    You're literally saying that they bought us out while we were deep in debt and financial trouble and on the verge of functional and administrative collapse, and are now building us back up to not only be a self-sufficient, but have also expanded and improved the grounds as part of the effort and plan to continue doing so (while keeping us in our spiritual home), just so that one day they can sell us off as a well-run, financially stable and self-sufficient operation,.......and this is bad.......how.....exactly?

    You object to the fact that they are businessmen who are good at what they do, have a good track record at doing it, making profit and are openly honest about it, and who don't come upon their fortunes by resources stolen or gotten through ill-gotten means in their home countries or crooked relationships with corrupt leaders.....just because they're American.
    And just because in your mind they come from a country that doesn't pay enough deferential respect to the sport, and genuflect enough to your liking at the altar of Football.

    Good to know.


    Also, need I remind you, Chelsea and City are part of the big 6 of those clubs backing this superleague.

    So they're also destroying the sport? or is it just the Americans?


    Quote Originally Posted by Steveo View Post
    I reject that your FSG folk are better than Roman - maybe more benign as individuals but not for Liverpool FC - I say they are worse for our club - and they and their ilk are MUCH MUCH worse for the sport.
    You're absolutely right.

    It would be far better for the club and far far far better for the sport if we, and everyone else were owned by Oil barons from countries with despicable human rights records, and who are friends with utterly corrupt leaders (And benefitting from said relationships), as their playthings, and who put on a good show and better performance at being the ones in it,......."for love of the game",......despite really being in it for anything but.
    And who also when they need to, drop a bucketload of cash whenever they need to escape punishment for breaking the rules that other clubs have to abide by (......allegedly)

    So so right.

    Thanks for setting me straight.

    /s
    To be precise it's only a portion of me downloaded via satellite.
    This Gynoid's E-brain lacks.........capacity.

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