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Thread: The demise part 2 - look away if you're superstitious

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Apr 2007

    The demise part 2 - look away if you're superstitious

    My opening post on that thread doesn't look so bad now, even though I think Steveo had proclaimed it hadn't stood the test of time. It finishes with;

    "So, my prediction is, the chaos will continue at United so long as the Owners, CEO and board pursue the current model. Doesn't matter if they appoint the best manager, build the biggest stadium or buy the biggest stars, its not enough. The whole, complex organism has to be brought into functional harmony. Even then, as with Klopp at Dortmund, success is not guaranteed. But it's guaranteed not to happen if the club hierarchy is failing."

    Anyone feel confident they will turn it round this time?

    I think their next manager selection is fraught with danger. The problem is with the Club Hierarchy most of all, who don't really know what to do next. They will be influenced by Ferguson, presumably, which hasn't been going very well.

    They have so far tried

    1) The up and coming tough Scotsman, in the mould of Ferguson (who at this moment looks to be the ideal choice)
    2) The top international, highly experienced manager
    3) The once greatest manager in football, with loads of Premiership and Champions league success
    4) The boot room choice, Fergie's boy, open to mentorship from Sir Alex

    They are back to square one. Even their recruitment hasn't gone well. Sancho and Ronaldo show that they don't have a good decision making process even if they have deep pockets.

    So the bookies think they will return to model 2)

    That could easily go pear shaped.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    I remember having arguments with the brc around the importance of structures and people in roles at a club.

    Brc argued the manager was paramount over all else. Klopp demonstrates the case superbly.

    United have few bonuses, money would be one of them. If they get the manager right then they could improve sharpish. But that's easier said than done. Their highest hope is ZZ.

    Their squad has some high profile failures, though I wouldn't consider ronny or sancho failures myself. They have a few players to find ways of moving on imo but again easier said than done.

    It seems as though they have been caught without a paddle.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Itís not that Ronaldo is a failure. The story seems to be that Ferguson intervened to stop him going to Man City.

    If thatís true, then itís questionable whether he was exactly what Ole wanted or needed most. The club hierarchy may have decided he was great for prestige or the clubís status etc

    These are factors that affect the role of the manager. Perhaps another manager would have vetoed it, but perhaps Ole wasnít strong enough. If so, the same people that secured the signing selected a manager that wasnít strong enough. So we are back to club organisation being influential before the manager can act.

    And it affected the teams he was able to put out - he even had Fergie saying you should play your best team when Ronaldo wasnít playing. This is the state of the club.

    Sancho was very expensive and hasnít been used much. Hard to imagine us spending 73 million on a player we arenít sure about.

    If you listen to the chatter about whatís happening at Utd, thereís an awful lot of criticism aimed at the club rather than at Ole. Thatís my basic position.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Quote Originally Posted by CCTV View Post
    United have few bonuses, money would be one of them. If they get the manager right then they could improve sharpish.
    It would only take a couple of decisions, decent coaching and their younger generation of hyper-entitled fans to find some patience for things to pick up.

    Their biggest issue in terms of what they can fix immediately is to utilise the players they have that can suit something resembling a system rather than this scattergun transfer approach for "name" players that leave them multiplying their weaknesses.

    For example they have quick forwards but are pretty woeful in build-up play. Counter-attacking football makes sense for them on paper, however the fact they have to leave a couple up the pitch to try and get something leaves them exposed, usually at full-back - and their defence is too poor to be being exposed.

    So the alternative is to try and get them to be better in the build-up, patterns etc - when they have a very average midfield that dwell too far behind their forwards and a right-back that genuinely looks allergic to having a football at his feet.

    Rock, hard place.
    Your hobbies are rollerblading and you're also a bit of a rat-hound? Steel Wool
    Sid knows he's crazy and he likes it. Balinkay

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    There were several of us on here who thought Ronaldo would have an overall negative affect on performances and it has been proven to be the case.
    Sancho is in danger of becoming Utdís Nicolas Pepe, if the next manager canít get the best out of him.

    Their squad is in a certain amount of disarray, despite having spent a fortune on defenders, their CBís are weak, their midfield is non existent and they still donít know what their best attacking line up is.

    As for Pogba, if he goes for nothing then theyíve lost an extremely expensive asset, if he stays on massive wages disrupting the dressing room theyíll have a very expensive lead weight they canít shift.
    Looks like a lose/lose situation.
    Theyíre going to have to spend very big to rebuild that squad, £300-500m if you ask me, even they canít keep going to the well at that rate.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Quote Originally Posted by Insidious View Post
    It would only take a couple of decisions
    Decision making is an underrated skill!

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Quote Originally Posted by miller0863 View Post
    There were several of us on here who thought Ronaldo would have an overall negative affect on performances and it has been proven to be the case.
    There were several who thought it signalled the final step in them rising above us.

    I didnít think it would necessarily be a success - I did think his positive state of mind might have a galvanising influence to make up for Oleís lack of managerial prowess. But the shite theyíve served up has surprised me, I must admit.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Seriously Taksin. You did it once and they went from 33 points behind us to 5 points ahead of us finishing second.

    They already rose above us in an instant following your last demise of United thread.

    Read the OP and look at what happened next.

    Also - United made some very good signings this summer too. Varane is quality and Sancho is a player half our fan base wanted. The fact that they couldnít face seeing Ronaldo in the sky blue of Shitty may well have hastened their clown of a managers departure.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Once again - threads of this nature are not clever

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Ah, it was my thread that did that. Nothing to do with objective facts

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