Your team v Leicester (League Cup)

[Nineteenx]

We have Virgil, Matip, Konate, Gomez and Philips on our books. That's 5 outright centrebacks with Philips & Konate to use over a season. We've had all availbe over weeks of the campaign.
Philips has proven himself with his performances and Konate doing great so far.
The fact Virgil is out with covid and Philips is out with injury for a few weeks is just a problem we have now. Neither are out long term.

I've said before my reason for 4231/42X is to get the best 11 players on the pitch when all are fit.

Ali
Back 4
Fabtastic
Front 4

Jota and Bobby get into the side over Thiago or anyone else like Keita. Both are immense in pressing and being disruptive.
If Gini were here, and I do appreciate your point that he was always available and we could sign a midfielder in January for our Hendo/Fab/Gini profile of player, I'd drop Gini too in our best 11.

Rest/subs/cover
2 : Milner, Thiago, Keita - Whatever formation, Gini's loss is felt here
Ox Gini Milner being an improvement on Morton the other night.
4: Ox, Taki, Origi, Jones and Keita again, Thiago wants minutes

We play more compact from midfield to attack and Salah has license to be the 1 in a 4231/451 playing where he always plays.
It asks Jota, Bobby and Mane to be a little more like our 8s whilst much more capable of joining Salah.

But seeing as how we lost Fab to covid, then thiago too and Hendo to covid like symptoms, tactical felixibility and adaptability could well be pivotal in winning the title.

Nope, doesn't work, when we've reverted to an orthodox 4231 in games since we stopped playing it, we've been exposed every single time by the opposition releasing players wide of our midfield 2, our forwards struggle because they're receiving the ball too deep, our full backs struggle because our forwards are deeper and in the space they are accustomed to making well timed runs into to be found in time and space, it simply doesn't work despite your long held obsession and fantasy with the system

The lopsided not 4231 or 433, more of a lopsided 433 than anything else but with 2 mids predominantly sitting has worked quite well of late, but it isn't a 4231, we have tried that for spells of games, and the issues I have long said would occur in trying to play that system where all there to be seen incredibly clearly in the periods of the game in which our players were set in a very orthodox 4231, it made at least 4 of our very best players entirely ineffectual, for exactly the reasons I always said it was a shit idea

[Nineteenx]

So you'd have Kante/Hendo/Rodri at 6 and drop either Mane or Mount for Foden.
I have gathered we have different views on Fabinho. If we were talking Peak levels of fitness and availability I'd have gone for Kante.

But we agree on the other 9 ?

Yep I agree on the other 9, Foden is also a monster and pretty relentless in the press too, his pressing alone is a difference maker for City, he's their best presser of the ball and the one who keeps all the others at it or gets them at it

No6 is a tough call, for me it couldn't be Fab because of his poor passing skills to release those forwards and full backs and he isn't good enough to play No6 alone in a high pressing 433 with LCM and RCM both ahead of him, although he is excellent with a Gini type controller sitting with him for a lot of the game in that lopsided 3 we've been playing

Your formation might be too attacking, could have issues on the counter, although Silva and Foden at LCM and RCM and their better awareness and pressing ability than all our players for those positions bar Hendo might make it ok

[CCTV]

Call it 42X if it pleases you.

Those 11 players make our best 11 as I see it.

[CCTV]

Yep I agree on the other 9, Foden is also a monster and pretty relentless in the press too, his pressing alone is a difference maker for City, he's their best presser of the ball and the one who keeps all the others at it or gets them at it

No6 is a tough call, for me it couldn't be Fab because of his poor passing skills to release those forwards and full backs and he isn't good enough to play No6 alone in a high pressing 433 with LCM and RCM both ahead of him, although he is excellent with a Gini type controller sitting with him for a lot of the game in that lopsided 3 we've been playing

Your formation might be too attacking, could have issues on the counter, although Silva and Foden at LCM and RCM and their better awareness and pressing ability than all our players for those positions bar Hendo might make it ok

I would entertain anybody else best 11 and whatever formation. I see less football than many on here, so will listen to their opinions.

With Foden I just sense he's a quitters from the times I've seen him play. Talented no doubt.

[Nineteenx]

I would entertain anybody else best 11 and whatever formation. I see less football than many on here, so will listen to their opinions.

With Foden I just sense he's a quitters from the times I've seen him play. Talented no doubt.

Hmmm, never seen him as a quitter, seems pretty relentless to me whenever I watch him play, has the odd off game, probably through overuse as he's still young and not long a full pro used to playing as many games in as short a period of time as seasoned pros

Silva and Foden, are both good in the press and counter press, good with the ball and good when in scoring or assisting positions

The next gen player like Tchouameni, Bellingham and Gravenberch are almost equally as gifted as those players with the ball, whilst being miles better physically and athletically and would bum either of that pair head to head in the right team

That's what I've been banging on about since our Champions League win, our ideal is to have players with the attributes of Hendo or Gini, but with greater all round technical ability, especially ability with the ball

[jozza800]

Every starting player from any one position? That sounds like the whole preferred 11 missing.?


Ok so that would be an extreme event would it not? But even then - IF we are genuinely an elite club (and we are the most successful club in the land last time I checked) we need to at least have players who can push those for a start in that first/preferred 11.. Otherwise we are always hoping and praying for miracle seasons with almost no key injuries (extremely rare) . Seasons where rivals have bans or owners in exile. Is that really our limit?

We need to have a player like Tsimikas for each position on the pitch. Genuine alternatives and genuine rotational options. Not players happy to kick a ball a few times a year and collect their wages!

We do have players like Tsimi who can come in and be rotated. Ox has come in and done fairly well, Keita looked bright early on in the season, Jones came in a sparkled for a couple of weeks and Milner is going to give you 7/10 every week.

The problem is what happened at the weekend, when they all have to come in together.

It is extreme. As was last season with our cbs. It can't be planned for.

I'm not saying that we can't improve, we should always look to improve. I'm saying that we cant expect our 8th choice midfielder to be at tbe same level as Hendo, Fab or Thiago. It's just not going to happen.

[jozza800]

I would also say we are competing with City and Chelsea. But we're not going to be able to match their spending power.

They've skewed the league so much that it might be impossible to sustain competition.

We could very well end the season with 90+ points and 100 goals and still finish a distant second (again...).

For us it's not sustainable. Klopp will go, and a good portion of the team are approaching their 30s. Its a roll of the dice whether our next side can match City.

City on the other hand will continue to pay £50m for fullbacks and £100m for the best players in the league to fill out their squad.

[CCTV]

Bellingham would be a good addition alright

[Nineteenx]

I'm not saying that we can't improve, we should always look to improve. I'm saying that we cant expect our 8th choice midfielder to be at tbe same level as Hendo, Fab or Thiago. It's just not going to happen.

Fab and Thiago aren't even at Hendo's or Gini's level, if we accept their level as being the highest after Hendo's given he's a brilliant option in our system in any of the midfield positions we employ, No6, No8 controller or attacking, then our 4th best option isn't anywhere near the level of any of those 3, our 5th best option even less so and so on and so on

Last season we had 4 of a much higher level than all the others and those four could all crucially play the No8 controller No6 and No8 attacking roles, Milner, a season younger and fitter was also a good option, but without that 4 one of whom was injured, we'd not be playing Champions League football this season

I think the point you're missing is the players skills sets, we only have four midfield players with the skills sets to play our pressing and counter pressing system successfully and to play the long standing roles in our side No6 and one or two controllers has long been our most used set up, the rest are a massive drop in quality and ability to play the pressing and counter pressing system and are only suited to playing RCM attacking midfield role, which we don't play in every game

[Nineteenx]

Bellingham would be a good addition alright

He'll be an excellent addition, but he's not a player who can play No6 for me (we NEED another for No6 in January), although I believe he'll excel at LCM or RCM in a controller or attacking CM role, if we can bag Tchouameni who has the same adaptability and flexibility as Hendo and has been brought through playing No6 in January and land Bellingham in the summer, we will be far closer to a fluid midfield 3 and the combination of Hendo and Gini like athleticism, power strength, awareness, reading of the game and understanding of the press and counter press, with the greater flair and technical ability with the ball many view as the difference between a Klopp and Guardiola midfield player