Reason No. 398,285 why it's not good to have your club owned by a Petro-Oligarch

[Taksin]

listen very carefully... I can see you are a bit of a chicken

you really can behave like a wanker, Steveo

I'm not interested in your or Noam Chomsky's take on the crimes of the USA - I have a well developed understanding of American foreign policy myself, in part thanks to many years of studying Chomsky and then seeing some of the flaws in his thinking.

But as I've stated twice without any response from you, this is irrelevant in the current discussion as the USA does not use sports to wash its reputation and neither do the American football owners that upset you so much. It's reputation couldn't be more hegemonic if it tried. Not only does it run the global economy and United Nations, it happens to be very popular with immigrants who flock there by the millions each year - a million legally and two million illegally this year alone - who see no threat to their human rights upon arrival. In some ways they enjoy better rights than the existing citizens in fact, which is something I doubt you could say about any other country in the world, as well as better human rights than in the original country.

Old stuck in the mud lefties like you get upset by these basic facts to the extent that you make the atrocious move of defending the treatment of, say, the Uyghur people as it suits your political position. I think its an absolute disgrace and derogation of your humanity that you would try to indicate that they are in some sense flourishing under the CCCP. But I've come to expect that line in argument from those desperate to elevate the harsh, grizzly communist regimes as some kind of save haven.

My objection to your comments a few posts ago was the following narrow point and it still stands;

The comparison is a bad one for modern times as the Native Americans are currently subject to full human rights in the US whereas the Uyghurs are currently subject to imprisonment, re-education, brainwashing, sterilisation, slavery and genocide.

Nothing you have said since changes this.

[Steveo]

Just drop it - or I will hand you your sorry arse again

The Uyghurs are still alive and they are a growing population - the Native American Indian has been all but wiped out. You say it’s a bad comparison - fine - but do you think they feel happy with their reservations? Think they have forgotten what happened to their culture, in their own native lands? You have now chosen to confine this exclusively to the human rights laws of the land. Your latest goal post shift, What human rights do the 20 plus million dead at the hands of post war US foreign policy have? The right to life? The right to chose their own President?

An Olympics in the US is just as much a sport wash (if the term actually means anything) as it would be anywhere - China absolutely included. It’s the same thing. China is in no need of our acceptance - we are utterly dependent on them - that is very much part of the problem for the US.

And if anyone is washing their image it is the US. And it is constant. In every film and TV show we watch, every toxic fast food brand we see plastered across our high street and the big brand sports clothing we see advertised on our idols - then buy. The benign US product.. it’s anything but.

It’s a racket. It’s the nature of the so called free market (anything but free). You are free as long as you buy our shit!

Sportswashing? - this is brainwashing. Stockholm syndrome.

Everything you defend and represent is reprehensible. Go support your local Tory party - you are a joke of a Liverpool fan.

Shankly would kick you in the fanny.

[Steveo]

Just a bit of banter Taksin.

But honestly if you cannot see your own glaring double standards - there is just no point.

Find another partner in crime

Meanwhile the great man’s words seem apt.

Worth posting on the day the Tories gave a tax break to business while subjecting the people to an interest rate hike and unsustainable increases in the cost of living.



We are living in the midst of the grandest of grand thefts.

[redebreck]

Apparently not.

3rd place - The Holy Roman Catholic Church owns roughly 177 million acres.

2nd place - King Abdullah of Saudi Arabia comes in at 531 million acres - 2nd only to:

1st place - King Charles III with 6.6 billion acres of land..!!

Nothing wrong with any of this of course.. Move along now - go back to sleep and do as you are told.

Fascinating, where did you find this information? I'd like to investigate further!

[Taksin]

An Olympics in the US is just as much a sport wash (if the term actually means anything) as it would be anywhere

Here is an actual, relevant argument in the midst of your usual over-emotional bile, unable as you are to follow or conduct a decent discussion.

The problem with this statement is it is self-contradictory - your usual high standards of debate on display; the US are also sports washing, although you can't see that it exists

I won't bother pursuing the argument as it can be predicted to go absolutely nowhere with you but safe to say I disagree with you on both counts

1) The US doesn't use sports to launder its reputation as it sees no need

2) Sports washing does exist, is well known and well understood by anyone who cares about sports

A wikipedia definition for those who still wonder 'if the term means anything'


Sportswashing is a term used to criticize the practice of individuals, groups, corporations, or governments using sports to improve reputations tarnished by wrongdoing. Sportswashing can be accomplished through hosting sporting events, purchasing or sponsoring sporting teams, or participating in a sport. At the international level, it is believed that sportswashing has been used to direct attention away from poor human rights records and corruption scandals. At the individual and corporate levels, it is believed that sportswashing has been used to cover up vices, crimes, and scandals. Sportswashing is an example of reputation laundering.

Oh, and by the way, I don't tie myself to the political ideology of football managers as I am not an imbecile. I realise that people can have differing political views and do not see this as a religious matter of faith or a tribal conflict. Shankly's use of communist rhetoric was great fun and made for excellent sporting tomfoolery but he clearly had a far better developed sense of humour than you do, as well as a level of common decency that you demonstrably lack

[Steveo]

Naaah - you are inventing your own scenarios.

Shankly didn’t use any specific communist rhetoric at all - he simply believed in people working together, striving to be the best they can be and for the common good.


Taksin - if that is communism - then you have a huge huge problem.

[Steveo]

Fascinating, where did you find this information? I'd like to investigate further!

It’s a good question. I found a few sources

One is Google

#1 Queen Elizabeth II
With her 6.6 billion acres, Elizabeth II is far and away the world's largest landowner, with the closest runner-up (King Abdullah) holding control over a mere 547 million, or about 12% of the lands owned by Her Majesty, The Queen.18


Another I read in this article

https://therealnews.com/chris-hedges-monarchs-belong-in-the-dustbin-of-history

And this one

https://www.businessinsider.com/worlds-biggest-landowners-2011-3?r=US&IR=T#2-king-abdullah-of-saudi-arabia-14

[CCTV]

1) The US doesn't use sports to launder its reputation as it sees no need

2) Sports washing does exist, is well known and well understood by anyone who cares about sports

A wikipedia definition for those who still wonder 'if the term means anything'


Sportswashing:is a term used to criticize
the practice of individuals, groups, corporations, or governments
using sports to improve reputations tarnished by wrongdoing.

Sportswashing can be accomplished through hosting sporting events, purchasing or sponsoring sporting teams, or participating in a sport.
At the international level, it is believed that sportswashing has been used to direct attention away from poor human rights records and corruption scandals.
At the individual and corporate levels, it is believed that sportswashing has been used to cover up vices, crimes, and scandals. Sportswashing is an example of reputation laundering.

1) the term is often used against companies like Nike. The definition provided shows it.
Michael Moore the yank put Phil Knight on the spot over it on camera.

It's a term that is used to criticise foremost,
Far moreso than it is ever sensibly demonstrated.

[Steveo]

Correct - I was going to add that it is by its very nature a quasi jingoistic term used almost exclusively by westerners to suggest deviousness on behalf of those them there bad folk, from the evil east. You don’t see the term applied to the US post Iraq… Afghanistan…Lewinsky…. Or Hicks and Gillett Or Nike and their sweatshops…. oh no.

If Murdoch bought United it wouldn’t be sport washing cause he is part of ‘the club’. If VW bought a Premier league side, that wouldn’t be sport wash either because they are those lovely German persons, who we trust absolutely. :
OK they got caught with their pants down lying about emissions - but come on - they are like us.. business people, besides they run their lovely adverts and PR campaigns and offer to do their bit for the environment. Give em a break.

It’s a little like the term conspiracy theory. It’s an attempt to tarnish in an instant, but only those outside of ‘the club’. or those, you know - nudge nudge those Vodka drinkers, those far far easterners ooooh - oh and also those brown people with cloth on their head.

What is incredible is that someone could cling like a limpet, to just one of its supposed elements “poor human rights” while ignoring all the others. Vice, crimes, and scandals. Obviously no US administration, business or wealthy individual have ever been guilty of such dark arts. AHEM!!

[Taksin]

Shankly didn’t use any specific communist rhetoric at all - he simply believed in people working together, striving to be the best they can be and for the common good.

I don’t mind that you get things wrong all the time but the arrogance is so dull.

This is what I was referring to;

“On the open top bus trip to Lime Street, Bill Shankly asked Brian Hall… “Son, You know about these things, who’s that Chairman with the red book, lots of sayings? The chinaman, what’s his name?” A bemused Brian Hall answered Chairman Mao to which Shankly replied “Aye, that’s him son, Chairman Mao, that’s him”…..

A few minutes later Shankly began to make a speech outside on the balcony of St. George’s Hall. Shanks held wide his arms and silence descended on the reds down below and delivered one of the greatest opening lines: “Chairman Mao has never seen the greatest show of red strength”