Liverpool transfers in/out and rumours 22/23 + Contracts

[RedMagic]

Know the story inside out and its total baloney to make the claim. Many clubs were implicated.

This narrative is driven by pure jealousy of a club that is simply far more successful than us or anyone. Precisely the same kinda stuff I see from fans of smaller clubs about us.

Perhaps you should more than "google it" and actually decipher what actually transpired. Nothing even close to Real Madrid being a state sponsored club.

Even IF you cannot spare the time to dig deep enough into it - just click the expand tab in the google term to see the European General Court ruling.

I don't think you do know the story inside out:- https://www.euronews.com/2021/03/04/eu-s-top-court-rules-spanish-fooball-clubs-received-illegal-state-aid

I know you think that everything bad in the world is down to the USA and its citizens, but unfortunately corruption, self interest, and dubious if not abhorrent behaviour is not just the preserve of those across the pond.

[Steveo]

I don't think you do know the story inside out:- https://www.euronews.com/2021/03/04/eu-s-top-court-rules-spanish-fooball-clubs-received-illegal-state-aid

I know you think that everything bad in the world is down to the USA and its citizens, but unfortunately corruption, self interest, and dubious if not abhorrent behaviour is not just the preserve of those across the pond.

Good lord man - look at the story. I assume you can decipher the difference between the 4 Spanish clubs involved AND also the fact that this is a case of "State aid" it has nothing exclusively to do with Real Madrid (even using a Barcelona Flag header) OR any of them being "State Funded" This is the state aid case where 4 Spanish clubs were implicated.

These are the 4 clubs Barcelona, Real Madrid, Athletic Bilbao and Atlético Osasuna

Guess which 4 clubs are NOT privately owned? Which 4 are owned by their fans? Hmm nothing to see here I assume. I think it is as clear as crystal that being fan owned is at odds with the inner workings of world football and its commercial nature.

And state aid is a very grey area - many claim that we - Liverpool FC have benefitted from that very thing much more recently and specifically around the "redevelopment" of Anfield. Many clubs have been in this situation regarding land in and around their grounds.

This is where you started:

Real Madrid are a bunch of state funded cheats. This gets ignored by the media, and because of that the general football fan is unaware that Real Madrid are the o.g. state funded club that are financially assisted by the Spanish state and Spanish banks.

Kings of Europe my backside.

I suggest you do a little more digging and see what you can find that actually supports this outlandish claim


It is simply not true. In fact it could hardly be further from the truth. Unlike us, owned by US billionaires with close links to former US presidents and the banking industry, Real are owned by their supporters.

And you also invent more stuff "I know you think that everything bad in the world is down to the USA and its citizens" More libellous crap. Probably intended as a dog whistle for the the fools on hill to pick up on.

AND I have never once suggested that American people - its citizens are in any way responsible for the US hegemony I have repeatedly said the opposite in fact. They are the victims. The average American has been totally abandoned - disenfranchised by their state in that very pursuit. The kind of which leaves 11 out of 20 premier league clubs fully or partly in the hands of their billionaires while "57% of Americans could not "put their hands on $1,000 if they have an emergency." RFK junior.

I know it's a football forum but seriously - it's frightening that some of you are old enough to vote

-

That last bit is not a direct shot at you RedMagic but it would help IF people actually read what posters have said - attempt to grasp their meaning....rather than base their views of another posters narrative on the misunderstanding of others.

[BOBPAISLEYFAN]

Good lord man - look at the story. I assume you can decipher the difference between the 4 Spanish clubs involved AND also the fact that this is a case of "State aid" it has nothing exclusively to do with Real Madrid (even using a Barcelona Flag header) OR any of them being "State Funded" This is the state aid case where 4 Spanish clubs were implicated.

These are the 4 clubs Barcelona, Real Madrid, Athletic Bilbao and Atlético Osasuna

Guess which 4 clubs are NOT privately owned? Which 4 are owned by their fans? Hmm nothing to see here I assume. I think it is as clear as crystal that being fan owned is at odds with the inner workings of world football and its commercial nature.

And state aid is a very grey area - many claim that we - Liverpool FC have benefitted from that very thing much more recently and specifically around the "redevelopment" of Anfield. Many clubs have been in this situation regarding land in and around their grounds.

This is where you started:



I suggest you do a little more digging and see what you can find that actually supports this outlandish claim


It is simply not true. In fact it could hardly be further from the truth. Unlike us, owned by US billionaires with close links to former US presidents and the banking industry, Real are owned by their supporters.

And you also invent more stuff "I know you think that everything bad in the world is down to the USA and its citizens" More libellous crap. Probably intended as a dog whistle for the the fools on hill to pick up on.

AND I have never once suggested that American people - its citizens are in any way responsible for the US hegemony I have repeatedly said the opposite in fact. They are the victims. The average American has been totally abandoned - disenfranchised by their state in that very pursuit. The kind of which leaves 11 out of 20 premier league clubs fully or partly in the hands of their billionaires while "57% of Americans could not "put their hands on $1,000 if they have an emergency." RFK junior.

I know it's a football forum but seriously - it's frightening that some of you are old enough to vote

-

That last bit is not a direct shot at you RedMagic but it would help IF people actually read what posters have said - attempt to grasp their meaning....rather than base their views of another posters narrative on the misunderstanding of others.

You defend Real Madrid with such conviction, and always seem to baulk at any seemed critique of them, are you actually deep down a big Real Madrid fan. You speak with such confidence and authority on matters, arguing that everything Real Madrid is, in your eyes, so Black and White, when in reality few things if any, ever are.

I am not arguing about the validity of any of the points you have made, as I have neither the interest the arguments or the will to do so, but what I am sure of is that the politics of the State and football clubs are so complicated, convoluted and nuanced, I find it difficult to see how anyone looking in, can be so convinced they know the real truth behind the Real Madrid story..

Unless there is an accepted forensic analysis carried out by independent bodies, with no axe to grind, unlikely, who provide irrefutable empirical evidence which clearly clarifies every element of claims made and truths established, there are always going to be those who argue the merits of their argument against those of another and so it goes on….

So whilst I agree its an interesting subject, personally I don't think any of us will ever truly know the exact story… pretty much like the current Premier League case against Man City, there will be a judgement but will that be the end of the matter, and will it be the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth… I am afraid not..but hey ho at least we can all look forward to the Chelsea game this weekend..����

[Steveo]

You defend Real Madrid with such conviction, and always seem to baulk at any seemed critique of them, are you actually deep down a big Real Madrid fan. You speak with such confidence and authority on matters, arguing that everything Real Madrid is, in your eyes, so Black and White, when in reality few things if any, ever are.

I am not arguing about the validity of any of the points you have made, as I have neither the interest the arguments or the will to do so, but what I am sure of is that the politics of the State and football clubs are so complicated, convoluted and nuanced, I find it difficult to see how anyone looking in, can be so convinced they know the real truth behind the Real Madrid story..

Unless there is an accepted forensic analysis carried out by independent bodies, with no axe to grind, unlikely, who provide irrefutable empirical evidence which clearly clarifies every element of claims made and truths established, there are always going to be those who argue the merits of their argument against those of another and so it goes on….

So whilst I agree its an interesting subject, personally I don't think any of us will ever truly know the exact story… pretty much like the current Premier League case against Man City, there will be a judgement but will that be the end of the matter, and will it be the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth… I am afraid not..but hey ho at least we can all look forward to the Chelsea game this weekend..����

Wow.. You are so funny. But It's no surprise that so many of you are unable to see that one thing has nothing to do with the other. It's a sport littered with the unthinking, sadly this forum has more than it's fair share. Probably why plenty have the sense to just disappear.

Please back up your claims: that I "defend Real Madrid with such conviction, and always seem to baulk at any seemed critique of them, are you actually deep down a big Real Madrid fan"

Because this is total crap. I have actively been in another daft debate with another individual who cannot accept reality..regarding the money that Real have been spending over decades to consistently bag the best players. I was doing quite the opposite of defending their brilliant "net spend" time and time again.

So - If you mean that must accept that they are "state funded cheats" to be in the - I'm the greatest Liverpool fan around because I hate Real Madrid.. then I gladly say NO FUCKING WAY.


Isn't it a little strange that you state how these things are 'in reality' never black and white YET you are silent when a poster makes outlandish claims - that have no truth to them whatsoever. Nothing beyond the same jealousy that we encounter from small-time fans of small time clubs.

And then you end with:
"I don't think any of us will ever truly know the exact story". The true story about what? And invented claim with no. base in truth of any kind.

Good lord - it's not hard to se why people just don't bother with this dying forum

[CCTV]

Flying off the handle and being a big drama queen, you're not very capable of debating.
There's a whole thread for you to reply to on the matter of spend.

[CCTV]

“constant criticism of the ground”

When and where exactly did I last do that?

Have a little think now - might need to sit down first tho

The brass neck on you

I replied to this post.

"Consistency" in this case is being the resident tit defending the resident moron who decides to drag a convo about the stadium into convo between 2 others on a totally unrelated topic.

Bugger me there must be sweet fuck all to do where yous 2 live.

Steveos emotional reading of the situation strikes again....

[Steveo]

Just lamenting the fact that we have so many posters who seem unable to think.

It seems I should not dare speak the truth.. I should agree to falsehoods and ignore the reality.

Where an ongoing dispute.. a grey area in EU/Spanish tax law regarding public/private land ownership and it's sale around football grounds - which as I see it is essentially just a ruse to force the 4 remaining fan owned Spanish clubs to become PLC's Businesses.. equates to Real Madrid being "state funded" Or be labelled a Real fan

Well forgive me my "emotional reading of the situation" I am so sorry


Either way - I must remember in future to join in with the minions when they Say - Booo Real are state funded Cheats - Chelsea were (oligarch...shh all billionaires are oligarchs) cheats.. Man City are cheats ( and we all suspect they are )- and Fergie only won those titles by cheating too - as he owned the FA and every ref out there. Bayern too are cheats they monopolise the German League and er - they are big blah blah. Booo - Only Liverpool FC - it was us alone who dominated for a long time and did so without breaking any rules.... Ner ner ne ner ne... So there.. Fingers in ears..

[CCTV]

“constant criticism of the ground”

When and where exactly did I last do that?

Have a little think now - might need to sit down first tho

The brass neck on you

I quoted one post of yours and replied.

You're persistently unimpressed with redevelopments.
To say this is off or surreal, Examples

Main stand, just 1 cheap project. The low interest loan provided by FSG, nothing. Cheapskates.

New training ground, cursed. Melwood going to provide social homes, a lack of green space. Melwood retained as a green space with Womens LFC, you proposed FSG profiting tidily in time from Women's footy.......

ARE, taking Anfield to 60k+, it looks awful, 4 different heights, look at Real & Spurs. Nice big bowls, super bowls. No unfilled corners. Everton on the water front...

1. Just lamenting the fact that we have so many posters who seem unable to think.

2. It seems I should not dare speak the truth.. I should agree to falsehoods and ignore the reality.

3 Where an ongoing dispute.. a grey area in EU/Spanish tax law regarding public/private land ownership and it's sale around football grounds - which as I see it is essentially just a ruse to force the 4 remaining fan owned Spanish clubs to become PLC's Businesses.. equates to Real Madrid being "state funded" Or be labelled a Real fan

4 Well forgive me my "emotional reading of the situation" I am so sorry

Either way - I must remember in future to join in with the minions when they Say - Booo Real are state funded Cheats - Chelsea were (oligarch...shh all billionaires are oligarchs) cheats.. Man City are cheats ( and we all suspect they are )- and Fergie only won those titles by cheating too - as he owned the FA and every ref out there. Bayern too are cheats they monopolise the German League and er - they are big blah blah. Booo - Only Liverpool FC - it was us alone who dominated for a long time and did so without breaking any rules.... Ner ner ne ner ne... So there.. Fingers in ears..

1. Well I find many people have no time to attend to interesting matters when it suits them.

2. You can post all you like about spending, there's a thread I've posted on the matter. To date you've offered little on the topic.

3. Again, I haven't been posting on these matters. I commented on your post.

4. I stand corrected

[BOBPAISLEYFAN]

Steveo, are you lamenting the fact that we have so many posters who seem unable to think.…. or are you lamenting the fact that we have so many posters who seem unable to think… “ Like You…”

In my defence, I only asked the question are you a closet Real Madrid fan, because tbf when I have previously made an off the cuff comment about RM’s record in the Champions League your reply was also extremely critical, however at no point did I say you were a RM fan, also I never stated that supporting any other club from another league as well as LFC, was an issue… supporting clubs from other leagues is entirely up to the individual and in no way does it affect any ones status as an LFC fan.

I also only questioned how any one can be so confident that they know the absolute definitive truth about any legal situation, when you are relying on information from at best third parties.. ie journalists, fans, ex-players, Managers etc etc and at worst from sources who it could be argued have vested interests in one version of events over another…

I would also like to think that we are all old enough and wise enough to know after witnessing numerous miscarriages of justice, that being found not guilty in court is also not absolute proof of innocence… in fact it could be argued that it reflects more on the quality of the lawyers employed, than it does on the validity of your innocence or guilt… Hence why Man City are currently throwing tens of millions of pounds on the best Legal defence available…

Presenting and defending your arguments is one thing, but accusing others of a lack of understanding and intellect just because they don't quite see things the same way as you do or have the same level of interest in the subject as you do, just kills any likelihood of further debate dead in its tracks…

[Steveo]

I quoted one post of yours and replied.

You're persistently unimpressed with redevelopments.
To say this is off or surreal, Examples

Main stand, just 1 cheap project. The low interest loan provided by FSG, nothing. Cheapskates.

New training ground, cursed. Melwood going to provide social homes, a lack of green space. Melwood retained as a green space with Womens LFC, you proposed FSG profiting tidily in time from Women's footy.......

ARE, taking Anfield to 60k+, it looks awful, 4 different heights, look at Real & Spurs. Nice big bowls, super bowls. No unfilled corners. Everton on the water front...



1. Well I find many people have no time to attend to interesting matters when it suits them.

2. You can post all you like about spending, there's a thread I've posted on the matter. To date you've offered little on the topic.

3. Again, I haven't been posting on these matters. I commented on your post.

4. I stand corrected

I don't see where you are going.

I am unimpressed to date - as we have only done 50% of what Real or Spurs have done with their redevelopments which encompass the entire stadium and imo constitutes the meaning of the word redevelopment. Had FSG just said we will build 1 or 2 new stands back in 2010 - there would have been rumblings.

Fact: Everton's Ground IS on the waterfont and looks impressive even if you are a red. Go and have a look around. It's location is better than L4 for a few key reasons, mainly logistical but also the visual.. but that's Everton.

I was always eager to stay at Anfield too - I have deep rooted family links to the area..BUT I was also pushing for a capacity increase way beyond the 60,000 ceiling - as this is the ONLY way to satisfy demand for tickets. Something which isn't of primary concern to owners who know that the sweet spot financially is where we are now - with the increase (relatively speaking) in the number of corporate facilities - seats and lounges. More money in TV revenues than bums on the cheap seats.

As for corners filled in - yep - would help with those extra seats and we could easily make our redevelopment mirror what was done at the magnificent (my personal favourite) Westfalen in Dortmund. Which is a proper and traditional club stadium, not as some call them "a bowl".

Taking red glasses off - the overall look of Anfield (that's as a single entity) as a building/Stadia has been compromised. It's more impressive in height but also now lacks any real cohesion aesthetically. It does look like a collection of stands. This is simply because ONLY 2 of the 4 stands have been addressed. Something I have repeatedly made suggestions for.

But my views on this have absolutely no bearing on me "Defending" Real. How on earth could anyone even make that leap? Certainly they could not HAD the actually read what I have said.

It is however a fact though - that Real Madrid's redevelopment of an already bigger and more impressive ground to an order of magnitude better stadia is light years ahead of our own...That is just the reality.
Nothing to do with defending Real Madrid as a club who enjoy a totally unique situation... mainly due to years of spending like lunatics - and capturing the very best players around year in year out...then winning and winning relentlessly down the decades.


This is also reality.

Real Madrid are not or even close to being "State Funded"...and are in fact further removed from that than a club like our own - seemingly was gifted for half price (clear the debt) in a closed bid to billionaire investors from across the pond via a yank at the head of the UK banking sector. (CEO of Barklays)

And to be clear....this entire to and fro has only occurred to pepper this thread with unrelated commentary due to justme bringing it into an unrelated discussion after I dared call out the claim that Real are "state funded".