Champions League last 16 draw Monday 7th Nov 11am

[Steveo]

And they say us Liverpool fans have selective memories. Sigh..

Is it me? Am I imagining it.. or were we not:

Poor v Sevilla….poor v Real…. Do the the stats not say we were poor v Spurs despite the result? Were were not a little below our usual standards and unable to score a single goal in the next 3 finals v Chelsea x2 and Real again.. Another 330 minutes of football (with Mané) and a big fat bagel next to goals scored?


I believe Klopp would be the first to admit it. It’s not like we were ever shit… nor is anyone saying that (dicko). Just that we have performed poorly - at least poorly relative to our own standards up to these finals.

The results point to it.. only the 1 actual victory outside of penalties in the last 6 finals. 1 in 7 if we include the League Cup final with City.

I would expect us to have a better record than that that’s all. Sorry if it offends any overly sensitive Liverpool fans who simply cannot entertain the thought.

[Insidious]

A range of thoughts from different users is likely but Finals aren't matches I've ever read too much into in terms of performances - perhaps that's due to the fact that there is so much tension amongst players (and exacerbated by fans) or perhaps it's just being focused on the result.

Prior to Klopp, Arsenal dominated us in the "Michael Owen" FA Cup Final (though we won anyway) and AC Milan dominated us in 04/05. I'm not sure if many sides have a formula to winning Finals and those that do are probably pretty superior in their respective League - I'd expect Bayern and Real Madrid to win more Finals due to their superiority in their respective Leagues.

My lens is probably skewed by my age. Whilst I was alive for our 18th title win I wasn't emotionally involved in it - my footballing life was "Man United win almost everything" then "Chelsea attempt to buy football" then "Man City buy football" with some intermittent success sprinkled in here and there.

Think I get your rough point though - Finals feature two teams and thus you'd want to see us be the better side in 50% or so of them and it hasn't been panning out that way for us. Only the lads in the dressing room will have insight into what we might do differently.

[jamesugw]

Do the the stats not say we were poor v Spurs despite the result? .

Steve, I think you're missing the wood for the trees here. Any decent team - like that Spurs team - that concedes in the first minute will naturally dominate proceedings (until they at least equalise). Especially in a cup final.

Flip it around: it would have been weird for Liverpool to have had 66% possession in a game where they took the lead in the first minute. As you know, football is much more than statistics. In that game, Spurs - naturally - had the lion's share of possession and chances but they didn't look remotely like scoring.

[Steveo]

Serious question Steveo: how many times have you had your nose smashed into your face in the offline world?

“Nose smashed into your face”

It’s not easy to find many people who are that thick - but I seem to have a knack of doing it.

Truth / not as often as you might think Justin. But I would have to kill you to tell you why…

[Steveo]

A range of thoughts from different users is likely but Finals aren't matches I've ever read too much into in terms of performances - perhaps that's due to the fact that there is so much tension amongst players (and exacerbated by fans) or perhaps it's just being focused on the result.

Prior to Klopp, Arsenal dominated us in the "Michael Owen" FA Cup Final (though we won anyway) and AC Milan dominated us in 04/05. I'm not sure if many sides have a formula to winning Finals and those that do are probably pretty superior in their respective League - I'd expect Bayern and Real Madrid to win more Finals due to their superiority in their respective Leagues.

My lens is probably skewed by my age. Whilst I was alive for our 18th title win I wasn't emotionally involved in it - my footballing life was "Man United win almost everything" then "Chelsea attempt to buy football" then "Man City buy football" with some intermittent success sprinkled in here and there.

Think I get your rough point though - Finals feature two teams and thus you'd want to see us be the better side in 50% or so of them and it hasn't been panning out that way for us. Only the lads in the dressing room will have insight into what we might do differently.

Very true Sid - finals are so often poor games.

I guess what I am asking is why we don’t score more goals in them.

I am a very nervous fan at the best of times. We have a knack of making it about 100 times worse in finals. At least that is how it feels to me.

[Steveo]

Steve, I think you're missing the wood for the trees here. Any decent team - like that Spurs team - that concedes in the first minute will naturally dominate proceedings (until they at least equalise). Especially in a cup final.

Flip it around: it would have been weird for Liverpool to have had 66% possession in a game where they took the lead in the first minute. As you know, football is much more than statistics. In that game, Spurs - naturally - had the lion's share of possession and chances but they didn't look remotely like scoring.

Agree - I actually suggested precisely the same thing. That early penalty (which was hugely soft despite few wanting to admit it) is the likely reason why those stats are skewed. An early lead in a final and especially after what happened to the season before - influenced our approach - almost certainly.

Has to be said about the final.. Although Spurs dominated those possession stats and passing stats -they really didn't trouble us much defensively. But that is likely because we took such an early lead and we were so much deeper. Virgil was like a wall at the back. YOU could see how we were going to be ready for another title push. Mane and Mo looked RAZOR sharp on the ball..despite us barely having a kick in that final.

All of that is true.

However those stats are there - and they are as valid as the stat about us never fielding the same side twice - and that team played out what appears - statistically speaking - a poor game

[justincredible]

“Nose smashed into your face”

It’s not easy to find many people who are that thick - but I seem to have a knack of doing it.

Truth / not as often as you might think Justin. But I would have to kill you to tell you why…

You'd probably bore me to death. I'll give you that lad...

[Steveo]

You'd probably bore me to death. I'll give you that lad...

Calm down "lad". so much anger.. not good

[justincredible]

I'm calm, I'm very calm lad....
I was just curious as to how you get on with your buffoonery out in the real world. If you do act the the same way as on here that is...

[Steveo]

You don't sound it me old mucker..

"Buffoonery" is good word to describe a 'lad' from the Emerald Isle trying to sound like he is Scouse. Wouldn't you say?