Football news part Trois

I never asked, nor cared about the languages you're referring to because we are right now communicating in ENGLISH, which is where your usage of that word and term was wrong as I was referring to.

I don't know whether your usage in those languages (which I neither know nor care about since we're not communicating in them) is right or wrong, so why would it matter?




Yes, and I told you that he was wrong when he did that.
(in the usage of the language that way. Not necessarily the substance which I wasn't addressing)

Which part of that confused you?

That famous people can also misuse the language?

Or that English people can also misuse their language?



I haven't a clue what in the hell you were even trying to say with all that drivel.





Yes.

You, sir, are an idiot

You interjected to say I was wrong in a reply to Steveo, you seem to care a lot. But you dont know which other languages I referred to, nor care to, you only care for the English speaking, like Churchill. But you reject Churchill & Justmes uses of the term in the English language.

Well I'm glad you haven't conflated anything in your cracking argument

Nobody on this forum, has ever commented on that article, aside from myself of course.

[Crimson Dynasty]

What about tribes and sects, where do they fit into all of this lol?

Ethnicity

(or ethnicities)

As in, literally synonyms for ethnicities.

[Crimson Dynasty]

Look, I made a very short post to Steveo.

So far you have told me that is incorrect, without asking or knowing the languages I was referring to, you seem to have a habit of telling me I'm wrong with certainty and here you know without knowing the languages in question.
That's an interesting position.

I never asked, nor cared about the languages you're referring to because we are right now communicating in ENGLISH, which is where your usage of that word and term was wrong as I was referring to.

I don't know whether your usage in those languages (which I neither know nor care about since we're not communicating in them) is right or wrong, so why would it matter?

I've then given you Winston Churchill using the term race with respect to Irish people, whislt speaking English.

Yes, and I told you that he was wrong when he did that.
(in the usage of the language that way. Not necessarily the substance which I wasn't addressing)

Which part of that confused you?

That famous people can also misuse the language?

Or that English people can also misuse their language?

He wanted a new relationship between Great Britain and Ireland to foster a "federation of English speaking peoples all over the world

Birds of a feather
Its only the English language that matters. My anthropological superiority in the sciences.

https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/german-chancellor-helmut-kohl-made-bid-to-influence-irelands-neutrality/29869826.html

Irish language services are no longer available in Ireland. English and Ukranian only now.

The term german race, can only really refer to 2 things.
1) A race in Germany, like a road race or an arms race
2) Or the German race/people. Like Helmut Kohl is of German race.

I haven't a clue what in the hell you were even trying to say with all that drivel.

I mean, we've not gotten to other languages at all, and it seems your reply is that Churhill used it wrong as did others in the recent past, and justme used it wrong just now.

Yes.

In English that is..

Yes, and he's wrong and incorrectly using the term (in its strictest definition).

Probably colloquially.

It happened a lot in the early and middle part of the last century whenever particular people would try to "other"-ize a particular group of people.
That didn't make it right.
Whether it was the Nazis in Germany with Jews or even the Romani (and sometimes even Polish), or as in this case with Churchill and the Irish, or as was done to the same Irish and Italians when they arrived in America as immigrants.
Any time "race" was used to refer to them by other white people, that was the intended purpose.

Did you think that appealing to authority (in this case, Churchill) was going to excuse your misunderstanding of how the English language (and words in it) work?

The term "race" has a very specific anthropological definition.

And yes, I also pointed out that you refenced that it's done that way in other languages, (and also why you did so.)

We're not speaking those other languages now, are we?

Look, I made a very short post to Steveo.

So far you have told me that is incorrect, without asking or knowing the languages I was referring to, you seem to have a habit of telling me I'm wrong with certainty and here you know without knowing the languages in question.
That's an interesting position.

I've then given you Winston Churchill using the term race with respect to Irish people, whislt speaking English.

Now i get more drivel from your sorry self

He wanted a new relationship between Great Britain and Ireland to foster a "federation of English speaking peoples all over the world

Birds of a feather
Its only the English language that matters. My anthropological superiority in the sciences.

https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/german-chancellor-helmut-kohl-made-bid-to-influence-irelands-neutrality/29869826.html

Irish language services are no longer available in Ireland. English and Ukranian only now.

The term german race, can only really refer to 2 things.
1) A race in Germany, like a road race or an arms race
2) Or the German race/people. Like Helmut Kohl is of German race.

I mean, we've not gotten to other languages at all, and it seems your reply is that Churhill used it wrong as did others in the recent past, and justme used it wrong just now.

[Steveo]

Not football news but some fucking monsters have killed Charlie Kirk... This is the world we are living in..


Sad times. He was a conservative and while I didn't agree with all of his views he was a good soul.. who spoke very well. Had a 1 year old child...Murdered for being accessible.


Sick.. Truly sick

[justme]

Ask the expert Steveo..

[sydenham red]

What about tribes and sects, where do they fit into all of this lol?

[Steveo]

its always been around us since the dawn of mankind.. some people have more than others.

Has it really? And there’s the rest of us stupidly believing it begins with the decline of feudalism in Europe…

We’ve had it all wrong

[Crimson Dynasty]

I originally posted it can be done in other languages, and that is true.

Here's an Englishman speaking in English about the Irish race.



So that's a prominent Englishman speaking in English about the Irish race.

Yes, and he's wrong and incorrectly using the term (in its strictest definition).

Probably colloquially.

It happened a lot in the early and middle part of the last century whenever particular people would try to "other"-ize a particular group of people.
That didn't make it right.
Whether it was the Nazis in Germany with Jews or even the Romani (and sometimes even Polish), or as in this case with Churchill and the Irish, or as was done to the same Irish and Italians when they arrived in America as immigrants.
Any time "race" was used to refer to them by other white people, that was the intended purpose.

Did you think that appealing to authority (in this case, Churchill) was going to excuse your misunderstanding of how the English language (and words in it) work?

The term "race" has a very specific anthropological definition.

And yes, I also pointed out that you refenced that it's done that way in other languages, (and also why you did so.)

We're not speaking those other languages now, are we?

[justme]

its always been around us since the dawn of mankind.. some people have more than others.

[Steveo]

See - now who’s dissing on famous Germanzzz

I am not a marxist tho justme - not even close - but he was right about Capitalism and the evidence is all around us

[justme]

In your imagination maybe be but that isn't what happened:

https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11095/13384956/david-coote-sacked-referee-charged-by-fa-for-comments-about-jurgen-klopp-but-no-charges-brought-over-gambling-misconduct-allegations



Many things are similar. BUT


Consider a scenario where a white European expresses animosity towards white British or American tourists, viewing them as culturally invasive. This would be an instance of xenophobia without the element of racism. Conversely, a person of colour who is a citizen of a predominantly white country experiencing discrimination from a white compatriot is a victim of racism, not xenophobia, as both individuals share the same nationality.

Are we getting anywhere?

are you getting anywhere Karl Marx?

This is incorrect.

You're conflating ethnicity with race.
They're not the same thing nor interchangeable.

Language is typically related to, and deritive of ethnicity and more pointedly of culture.
Not necessarily (nor strictly) to or of nationality.

There are very few (if any) monoethnic nations in the world left today in which you could argue that the ethnicity and race of the people is singular (and therefore) interchangeable with the nationality or the national identity.

Even in Africa and sub-Saharan Africa where some would be wont to equate "black" with the countries as their singular identity, it's mostly not true anymore thanks to colonialism and immigration where you have native non-black people that are "African" born, raised and culturally African, but not "black" in the sense of their race.
Places like Japan used to be considered monoethnic due to their strong homogenuity in their ethnic composition, but even they today are more diverse in terms of their ethnic and racial diversity to be considered strictly monoethnic anymore.

There's no such thing as a "German race" - at least not in the English language (which is why you probably tried to qualify it by claiming this to be the case in other languages. It doesn't work that way in English).

Nor a "...German-speaking race"

There is a German nationality (defined by national border but not by a single ethnicity or race), ....or a Germanic Ethnicity (Not specifically defined by, nor confined to national borders, as it's found throughout Europe, including within the British Isles, all the way up to the British monarchy who have Germanic heritage and roots.)

I originally posted it can be done in other languages, and that is true.

Here's an Englishman speaking in English about the Irish race.

In 1904 ten years before the passage of the third Home Rule bill, Churchill said about Irish Home Rule: "I remain of the opinion that a separate parliament for Ireland would be dangerous and impractical." He held a belief that Ireland should have remained part of the United Kingdom. However, in 1912, during a speech in Belfast, he supported the creation of an Irish parliament ruled from Dublin, a decision that upset Ulster Unionists. These comments were seen as a retraction of his comments from 1904. He said: "History and poetry, justice and good sense, alike demand that this race, gifted, virtuous and brave, which has lived so long and endured so much should not, in view of her passionate desire, be shut out of the family of nations and should not be lost forever among indiscriminate multitudes of men." He wanted a new relationship between Great Britain and Ireland to foster a "federation of English speaking peoples all over the world".[76]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racial_views_of_Winston_Churchill

So that's a prominent Englishman speaking in English about the Irish race.

[Steveo]

Errrr what comment what was used that was the worst? any? Its likely the criticism of him being "German" was the worst and all in likelihood got him removed..

In your imagination maybe be but that isn't what happened:

https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11095/13384956/david-coote-sacked-referee-charged-by-fa-for-comments-about-jurgen-klopp-but-no-charges-brought-over-gambling-misconduct-allegations

"Xenophobia and racism are similar as both has roots in discrimination"

Many things are similar. BUT


Consider a scenario where a white European expresses animosity towards white British or American tourists, viewing them as culturally invasive. This would be an instance of xenophobia without the element of racism. Conversely, a person of colour who is a citizen of a predominantly white country experiencing discrimination from a white compatriot is a victim of racism, not xenophobia, as both individuals share the same nationality.

Are we getting anywhere?